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What is the relationship between wanting them to lose billions and having that option? Sounds like you're just wishing harm on the organization that gave you th

• smoldesu 3y ago
  If giving the user more power over software installation hurts Apple, then I guess I am wishing them harm. If Apple's approach was without harm though, they wouldn't have been targeted by European regulators with the DMA in the first place.
  • pb7 3y ago
    That's not what the original comment said though. The comment was about companies losing money, not about gaining certain freedoms.
    • smoldesu 3y ago
      I didn't write that comment :P My point was less related to the cause-and-effect, and more focused on the undeniable need for user control. Apple is the reason why the Digital Market Act exists - go read it, you'll very quickly realize that the language targets them. It also (rightfully) implicates Microsoft and Google, but it very explicitly paints Apple's relationship with the iPhone as a "Gatekeeper" situation. The reasoning should be obvious; OEMs don't deserve that level of control. Apple could implement all of their meaningful features competitively, as-is, without being the sole trusted distributor of iPhone apps. Plus, even if you love Apple and hate Europe, features like this let you meaningfully resist European mandates. If Europe demands that SMS apps have a backdoor (fancy that), Apple users would have options that aren't provided by Apple. In a world where FAANG is bought and owned by the US government and gets regularly subpoenaed for data, that might be an affordance you value.
      • discard124 3y ago
        > If Europe demands that SMS apps have a backdoor (fancy that), Apple users would have options that aren't provided by Apple. This makes no sense. If Europe makes rules about backdoors or outlawing E2E, they will apply to every app store and every app, not just Apple.
        • smoldesu 3y ago
          Makes sense to me. If E2EE got banned, I could go download Free and Open Source applications from the internet that circumvent that ban. That's how it works on all of my computers right now, if Apple still demands override controls after letting you install third-party apps, then maybe we'll need a second Digital Market Act. I reckon we'll cross that bridge when we come to it.
          • dwaite 3y ago
            Doesn’t track with me. If the EU legislates the market they can legislate blocking those E2E apps from the internet. For instance, require apps to be installed from alternative marketplaces and not just sideloaded, and heavily regulate alternative marketplaces.
          • discard124 3y ago
            More likely, the EU will demand that alternative stores be regulated and that override controls exist, precisely so that they can outlaw E2EE and block other apps they want to restrict. The EU isn’t doing any of this to support some principle of end-user freedom. It’s all just a consequence of lobbying and politics. They aren’t going to do anything that reduces their own control.
• politelemon 3y ago
  > on the organization that gave you this platform in the first place. Seems a little unhinged. I think the reasoning was pretty concise although throwing shade, referring to it as unhinged is uncalled for. I think I see this a bit too much on HN but bears repeating: your favorite trillion dollar company does not need to be defended. It is unlikely you'd be calling it unhinged if similar sentiments were expressed about Google, Microsoft or Facebook.
• jncfhnb 3y ago
  The billions of platform taxes ought to be in the hands of consumers who, given fair competition for platforms on the hardware of their preference, would see far lower software costs.