3 ms·

Hydro power… it’s like 50% of their power. Then wind, then biomass, then solar.

by paiute 3y ago

toomuchtodo 3y ago
China has deployed more wind power this year than the UK's total aggregate generation capacity, and double US total aggregate solar generation. Yes, South America has a substantial amount of existing hydro power, but this is no excuse for developed world laggards. It is a choice to prioritize oil, gas, and other fossil fuel subsidies and infra support, but it is hopeless with global EV and renewables manufacturing flywheels coming up to speed (China is selling ~1 million EVs per month as of 2023Q4, solar PV manufacturing will reach 1TW next year). Just as Tesla (and BYD in China, credit where credit due) was the underdog and "David" until they rocketed passed legacy auto and became "Goliath", the same will happen to clean energy vs fossil tech. Like a recession, you're not going to be able to call it until looking back at trailing indicators. https://www.iea.org/reports/renewable-energy-market-update-june-2023/is-there-enough-global-wind-and-solar-pv-manufacturing-to-meet-net-zero-targets-in-2030 https://www.iea.org/reports/renewable-energy-market-update-j... https://www.theguardian.com/business/2023/nov/13/chinas-carbon-emissions-set-for-structural-decline-from-next-year https://www.theguardian.com/business/2023/nov/13/chinas-carb... > The most striking growth has been in solar power, according to Myllyvirta. Solar installations increased by 210 gigawatts (GW) this year alone, which is twice the total solar capacity of the US and four times what China added in 2020. > The analysis, which is based on official figures and commercial data, found that China installed 70GW of wind power this year – more than the entire power generation capacity of the UK. It is also expected to add 7GW of hydro power and 3GW of nuclear power capacity this year, said the report. https://www.carbonbrief.org/analysis-chinas-emissions-set-to-fall-in-2024-after-record-growth-in-clean-energy/ https://www.carbonbrief.org/analysis-chinas-emissions-set-to... > China’s carbon dioxide (CO2) emissions are set to fall in 2024 and could be facing structural decline, due to record growth in the installation of new low-carbon energy sources. (my note: pedal to the floor, no one ever said "we have too much clean energy!")
- zdragnar 3y ago
  When you have the benefit of being able to move millions of people by force to build a dam, and get to produce solar panels with slave labor, it's way easier.
  - toomuchtodo 3y ago
    Those are very bad things, no doubt whatsoever, but the data shows it is unnecessary for success. US solar and battery/storage manufacturing is exploding due to Inflation Reduction Act incentives, for example. Those bad things are not an excuse to not push scaling harder faster. Automation is a substantial component of solar and battery manufacturing, and you can build that automation with willing labor earning fair compensation. https://pv-magazine-usa.com/2023/08/14/over-155-gw-of-u-s-solar-manufacturing-announced-in-one-year/ https://pv-magazine-usa.com/2023/08/14/over-155-gw-of-u-s-so... https://www.spglobal.com/marketintelligence/en/news-insights/latest-news-headlines/ira-at-1-us-heralds-clean-energy-manufacturing-renaissance-76610817 https://www.spglobal.com/marketintelligence/en/news-insights... https://www.utilitydive.com/spons/ira-sets-the-stage-for-us-energy-storage-to-thrive/635665/ https://www.utilitydive.com/spons/ira-sets-the-stage-for-us-...
  - mandmandam 3y ago
    1 in 6 American workers stay in unwanted jobs just to keep their healthcare [0]. Is that so different? Americans will tell you with a straight face that giving people free college will affect the numbers joining the military - is that so different? Also, seems to me that the 8 trillion, with a t, dollars that were spent creating terror in the middle east would have bought a few panels. To compare directly, the highest estimate for transitioning the US to 100% renewable electricity is 5.7 trillion dollars [1]. So, if we'd just killed about 600,000 fewer civilians we could afford the change. Pointing fingers at China is easier than accepting our own actions, but you know, there's a lot to be said for taking responsibility for what one can actually change. 0 - https://news.gallup.com/poll/349094/workers-stay-unwanted-job-health-benefits.aspx https://news.gallup.com/poll/349094/workers-stay-unwanted-jo... 1 - https://www.instituteforenergyresearch.org/renewable/cost-of-transitioning-to-100-percent-renewable-energy/ https://www.instituteforenergyresearch.org/renewable/cost-of...
dmoy 3y ago
Yea but like parts of the PNW are >50% hydro too (Seattle is >80%), but they still haven't ever closed the gap to 100% for any significant length of time.
- iamawacko 3y ago
  Seattle City Light, according to a 2016 report (and its definitely improved since), was 88% Hydro, 5% nuclear, and 4% wind. https://app.electricitymaps.com/map https://app.electricitymaps.com/map reports Seattle City Light as 100% hydro, fwiw.
- lytfyre 3y ago
  BC Hydro (British Columbia electric power utility, government owned) was 98% renewable sources in 2022, ~91% of that hydro[1] - for the entire province. that last 2% is going to take a lot of work to replace, but I'd be surprised to see it backslide. [1] https://www.bchydro.com/content/dam/BCHydro/customer-portal/documents/corporate/accountability-reports/financial-reports/annual-reports/bc-hydro-quick-facts-2022-23.pdf https://www.bchydro.com/content/dam/BCHydro/customer-portal/...

Hydro power… it’s like 50% of their power. Then wind, then biomass, then solar.

by paiute 3y ago

Hydro power… it’s like 50% of their power. Then wind, then biomass, then solar.

China has deployed more wind power this year than the UK's total aggregate generation capacity, and double US total aggregate solar generation. Yes, South America has a substantial amount of existing hydro power, but this is no excuse for developed world laggards. It is a choice to prioritize oil, gas, and other fossil fuel subsidies and infra support, but it is hopeless with global EV and renewables manufacturing flywheels coming up to speed (China is selling ~1 million EVs per month as of 2023Q4, solar PV manufacturing will reach 1TW next year). Just as Tesla (and BYD in China, credit where credit due) was the underdog and "David" until they rocketed passed legacy auto and became "Goliath", the same will happen to clean energy vs fossil tech. Like a recession, you're not going to be able to call it until looking back at trailing indicators. https://www.iea.org/reports/renewable-energy-market-update-june-2023/is-there-enough-global-wind-and-solar-pv-manufacturing-to-meet-net-zero-targets-in-2030 https://www.iea.org/reports/renewable-energy-market-update-j... https://www.theguardian.com/business/2023/nov/13/chinas-carbon-emissions-set-for-structural-decline-from-next-year https://www.theguardian.com/business/2023/nov/13/chinas-carb... > The most striking growth has been in solar power, according to Myllyvirta. Solar installations increased by 210 gigawatts (GW) this year alone, which is twice the total solar capacity of the US and four times what China added in 2020. > The analysis, which is based on official figures and commercial data, found that China installed 70GW of wind power this year – more than the entire power generation capacity of the UK. It is also expected to add 7GW of hydro power and 3GW of nuclear power capacity this year, said the report. https://www.carbonbrief.org/analysis-chinas-emissions-set-to-fall-in-2024-after-record-growth-in-clean-energy/ https://www.carbonbrief.org/analysis-chinas-emissions-set-to... > China’s carbon dioxide (CO2) emissions are set to fall in 2024 and could be facing structural decline, due to record growth in the installation of new low-carbon energy sources. (my note: pedal to the floor, no one ever said "we have too much clean energy!")

zdragnar 3y ago
When you have the benefit of being able to move millions of people by force to build a dam, and get to produce solar panels with slave labor, it's way easier.
- toomuchtodo 3y ago
  Those are very bad things, no doubt whatsoever, but the data shows it is unnecessary for success. US solar and battery/storage manufacturing is exploding due to Inflation Reduction Act incentives, for example. Those bad things are not an excuse to not push scaling harder faster. Automation is a substantial component of solar and battery manufacturing, and you can build that automation with willing labor earning fair compensation. https://pv-magazine-usa.com/2023/08/14/over-155-gw-of-u-s-solar-manufacturing-announced-in-one-year/ https://pv-magazine-usa.com/2023/08/14/over-155-gw-of-u-s-so... https://www.spglobal.com/marketintelligence/en/news-insights/latest-news-headlines/ira-at-1-us-heralds-clean-energy-manufacturing-renaissance-76610817 https://www.spglobal.com/marketintelligence/en/news-insights... https://www.utilitydive.com/spons/ira-sets-the-stage-for-us-energy-storage-to-thrive/635665/ https://www.utilitydive.com/spons/ira-sets-the-stage-for-us-...
- mandmandam 3y ago
  1 in 6 American workers stay in unwanted jobs just to keep their healthcare [0]. Is that so different? Americans will tell you with a straight face that giving people free college will affect the numbers joining the military - is that so different? Also, seems to me that the 8 trillion, with a t, dollars that were spent creating terror in the middle east would have bought a few panels. To compare directly, the highest estimate for transitioning the US to 100% renewable electricity is 5.7 trillion dollars [1]. So, if we'd just killed about 600,000 fewer civilians we could afford the change. Pointing fingers at China is easier than accepting our own actions, but you know, there's a lot to be said for taking responsibility for what one can actually change. 0 - https://news.gallup.com/poll/349094/workers-stay-unwanted-job-health-benefits.aspx https://news.gallup.com/poll/349094/workers-stay-unwanted-jo... 1 - https://www.instituteforenergyresearch.org/renewable/cost-of-transitioning-to-100-percent-renewable-energy/ https://www.instituteforenergyresearch.org/renewable/cost-of...

dmoy 3y ago

Yea but like parts of the PNW are >50% hydro too (Seattle is >80%), but they still haven't ever closed the gap to 100% for any significant length of time.

iamawacko 3y ago
Seattle City Light, according to a 2016 report (and its definitely improved since), was 88% Hydro, 5% nuclear, and 4% wind. https://app.electricitymaps.com/map https://app.electricitymaps.com/map reports Seattle City Light as 100% hydro, fwiw.
lytfyre 3y ago
BC Hydro (British Columbia electric power utility, government owned) was 98% renewable sources in 2022, ~91% of that hydro[1] - for the entire province. that last 2% is going to take a lot of work to replace, but I'd be surprised to see it backslide. [1] https://www.bchydro.com/content/dam/BCHydro/customer-portal/documents/corporate/accountability-reports/financial-reports/annual-reports/bc-hydro-quick-facts-2022-23.pdf https://www.bchydro.com/content/dam/BCHydro/customer-portal/...