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The current government is pretty weak and one of their promises before the election was to increase nuclear energy. So this is pretty much something they had t

The current government is pretty weak and one of their promises before the election was to increase nuclear energy. So this is pretty much something they had to announce to keep voters happy. Whether it will happen in practice is another question. I guess at some point someone will have to make a business plan that shows that it is also a good investment.

UberFly 3y ago
Is moving away from Russian energy also a factor?
- fifilura 3y ago
  For Sweden not that much. Sweden was always an energy exporter and not really depending on Russia. Neighbouring countries such as Finland have been more dependant on Russia and the imports from Sweden have increased because of cutting the Russian gas. This has had secondary effects on Sweden by increasing the electricity price.
  - Hamuko 3y ago
    >Neighbouring countries such as Finland have been more dependant on Russia and the imports from Sweden have increased because of cutting the Russian gas. Eh. Natural gas accounted for less than 5% of Finland's total energy consumption before Russia cut off the gas pipelines. And this was before Finland got a new floating LNG terminal (January 2023) and the new 1600 MW reactor came online (April 2023).
    - fifilura 3y ago
      But I guess those 5% made a difference before 2023.
- Erikun 3y ago
  Not directly, Sweden is a net exporter of electricity.
- shinryuu 3y ago
  Sweden's dependency on russian energy is relatively low to begin with. https://www.energimyndigheten.se/nyhetsarkiv/2022/ar-svensk-energiforsorjning-beroende-av-ryssland/ https://www.energimyndigheten.se/nyhetsarkiv/2022/ar-svensk-...
shinryuu 3y ago
The Swedish government initial stance was that the market should completely bear the burden of the costs for nuclear energy. Though they had to walk that back because Vattenfall clearly pointed out that unless the government goes in with subsidies they won't do it. The government had earlier proposed the equivalent of ~40 billion euro in credit guarantees, but that wasn't enough. So now the goverment and vattenfall is working out an agreement where the state takes part of the risk (and profit, if any). Coming from a right-wing government that has ideals of a market based economy, it's ... counterintuitive that this is the way they want to do it.
- cjg_ 3y ago
  Vattenfall is fully state-owned anyway.
  - actionfromafar 3y ago
    Vattenfall invested heavily (hugely) in German brown coal, then shelved it. Swedish tax payers effectively accelerating German energy off brown coal. In the greater scheme of things, not sure what to think of it, but as an investment, it was pretty bad.
    - fifilura 3y ago
      Yeah they also invested in Dutch natural gas which was a catastropic deal. I think the relationship between the government and Vattenfall is heavily regulated so that they can't micromanage and have to set high profit goals for the company. It is probably required so that it does not interfere with market economy.
      - actionfromafar 3y ago
        Articles at the time seem to disagree about the "without political oversight" part, focusing on the political nature of the decision: https://www.svt.se/nyheter/lokalt/vasterbotten/olofsson-varnades-for-nej-till-nuon https://www.svt.se/nyheter/lokalt/vasterbotten/olofsson-varn... They might have invested in nuclear if they didn't buy coal, couldn't have that. Also, I think the largest cash deal in Swedish history is something that is just moving along together with the new coffee machine for the lobby, without political oversight. The decision also went by the prime minister, although he at first disputed it: https://sv.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maud_Olofsson https://sv.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maud_Olofsson https://www.svd.se/a/Rxl708/drev-igenom-tva-av-sveriges-absolut-samsta-affarer https://www.svd.se/a/Rxl708/drev-igenom-tva-av-sveriges-abso... https://www.svt.se/nyheter/inrikes/olofsson-vagrar-svara-pa-fragan-vem-visste-vad https://www.svt.se/nyheter/inrikes/olofsson-vagrar-svara-pa-... https://sverigesradio.se/artikel/5861519 https://sverigesradio.se/artikel/5861519
beezlewax 3y ago
Doing things to keep voters happy is their job.
- fifilura 3y ago
  That is the psychology behind populism. Might as well say that my job is keeping my kids happy. That is why I give them candies instead of dinner.
  - stickfigure 3y ago
    Parents aren't elected to serve their children.
    - SV_BubbleTime 3y ago
      It’s telling to me that some people are very ready to equate government to parents.
      - phatfish 3y ago
        The abstract idea of a (democratic, elected) government is parental, it is supposed to run a country to better the lives of its citizens. Whether some of the people that gain power in government are even adults is debatable though.
    - fifilura 3y ago
      Fair enough possible that the analogy halts. But .. . 1. promise something with a simple message that is an oversimplification to get enogh voters. 2. Do it because you promised the voters. Even if it is a bad idea and will not lead to good results.
  - jbm 3y ago
    The alternative ("we will tell you what is good for you") led to Canadian cities looking like a time machine to the 90s. As a voter and not a member of the elite, I prefer having trains built and new cities expanded for our growing population, rather than incantations being offered to irrational secular gods ("the markets") and the constant shrinkage of beds in our healthcare system.
eesmith 3y ago
Perhaps relevant background, the HN posting on Oct 14, 2022 titled "Sweden’s incoming cabinet says new nuclear reactors will be built" has 539 comments. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=33208156 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=33208156 It points to a Bloomberg article at https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2022-10-14/sweden-s-incoming-cabinet-says-will-build-new-nuclear-reactors https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2022-10-14/sweden-s-... .

UberFly 3y ago

Is moving away from Russian energy also a factor?

fifilura 3y ago
For Sweden not that much. Sweden was always an energy exporter and not really depending on Russia. Neighbouring countries such as Finland have been more dependant on Russia and the imports from Sweden have increased because of cutting the Russian gas. This has had secondary effects on Sweden by increasing the electricity price.
- Hamuko 3y ago
  >Neighbouring countries such as Finland have been more dependant on Russia and the imports from Sweden have increased because of cutting the Russian gas. Eh. Natural gas accounted for less than 5% of Finland's total energy consumption before Russia cut off the gas pipelines. And this was before Finland got a new floating LNG terminal (January 2023) and the new 1600 MW reactor came online (April 2023).
  - fifilura 3y ago
    But I guess those 5% made a difference before 2023.
Erikun 3y ago
Not directly, Sweden is a net exporter of electricity.
shinryuu 3y ago
Sweden's dependency on russian energy is relatively low to begin with. https://www.energimyndigheten.se/nyhetsarkiv/2022/ar-svensk-energiforsorjning-beroende-av-ryssland/ https://www.energimyndigheten.se/nyhetsarkiv/2022/ar-svensk-...

shinryuu 3y ago

The Swedish government initial stance was that the market should completely bear the burden of the costs for nuclear energy. Though they had to walk that back because Vattenfall clearly pointed out that unless the government goes in with subsidies they won't do it. The government had earlier proposed the equivalent of ~40 billion euro in credit guarantees, but that wasn't enough. So now the goverment and vattenfall is working out an agreement where the state takes part of the risk (and profit, if any). Coming from a right-wing government that has ideals of a market based economy, it's ... counterintuitive that this is the way they want to do it.

cjg_ 3y ago
Vattenfall is fully state-owned anyway.
- actionfromafar 3y ago
  Vattenfall invested heavily (hugely) in German brown coal, then shelved it. Swedish tax payers effectively accelerating German energy off brown coal. In the greater scheme of things, not sure what to think of it, but as an investment, it was pretty bad.
  - fifilura 3y ago
    Yeah they also invested in Dutch natural gas which was a catastropic deal. I think the relationship between the government and Vattenfall is heavily regulated so that they can't micromanage and have to set high profit goals for the company. It is probably required so that it does not interfere with market economy.
    - actionfromafar 3y ago
      Articles at the time seem to disagree about the "without political oversight" part, focusing on the political nature of the decision: https://www.svt.se/nyheter/lokalt/vasterbotten/olofsson-varnades-for-nej-till-nuon https://www.svt.se/nyheter/lokalt/vasterbotten/olofsson-varn... They might have invested in nuclear if they didn't buy coal, couldn't have that. Also, I think the largest cash deal in Swedish history is something that is just moving along together with the new coffee machine for the lobby, without political oversight. The decision also went by the prime minister, although he at first disputed it: https://sv.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maud_Olofsson https://sv.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maud_Olofsson https://www.svd.se/a/Rxl708/drev-igenom-tva-av-sveriges-absolut-samsta-affarer https://www.svd.se/a/Rxl708/drev-igenom-tva-av-sveriges-abso... https://www.svt.se/nyheter/inrikes/olofsson-vagrar-svara-pa-fragan-vem-visste-vad https://www.svt.se/nyheter/inrikes/olofsson-vagrar-svara-pa-... https://sverigesradio.se/artikel/5861519 https://sverigesradio.se/artikel/5861519

beezlewax 3y ago

Doing things to keep voters happy is their job.

fifilura 3y ago
That is the psychology behind populism. Might as well say that my job is keeping my kids happy. That is why I give them candies instead of dinner.
- stickfigure 3y ago
  Parents aren't elected to serve their children.
  - SV_BubbleTime 3y ago
    It’s telling to me that some people are very ready to equate government to parents.
    - phatfish 3y ago
      The abstract idea of a (democratic, elected) government is parental, it is supposed to run a country to better the lives of its citizens. Whether some of the people that gain power in government are even adults is debatable though.
  - fifilura 3y ago
    Fair enough possible that the analogy halts. But .. . 1. promise something with a simple message that is an oversimplification to get enogh voters. 2. Do it because you promised the voters. Even if it is a bad idea and will not lead to good results.
- jbm 3y ago
  The alternative ("we will tell you what is good for you") led to Canadian cities looking like a time machine to the 90s. As a voter and not a member of the elite, I prefer having trains built and new cities expanded for our growing population, rather than incantations being offered to irrational secular gods ("the markets") and the constant shrinkage of beds in our healthcare system.

eesmith 3y ago

Perhaps relevant background, the HN posting on Oct 14, 2022 titled "Sweden’s incoming cabinet says new nuclear reactors will be built" has 539 comments. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=33208156 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=33208156 It points to a Bloomberg article at https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2022-10-14/sweden-s-incoming-cabinet-says-will-build-new-nuclear-reactors https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2022-10-14/sweden-s-... .