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That was the goal of both Korea and China, both of them early on appeared to reach this goal. That goal is not nefarious, but choosing the Chinese model when we

by toolz 3y ago

That was the goal of both Korea and China, both of them early on appeared to reach this goal. That goal is not nefarious, but choosing the Chinese model when we watched it fail in Italy does appear to be gross incompetence since we did know without question that the Chinese model would have drastic consequences whether it succeeded or not.

svnt 3y ago
I guess I’m not sure what your implied alternative is to the “Chinese Model” which I don’t think anyone can credibly say we accurately emulated — what would you have preferred we do and whose model would that have been? Sweden’s?
- toolz 3y ago
  Today? It should go without saying we shouldn't have locked down. Somehow there are still people holding onto the idea it was a justified measure, but what we know today simply makes that option look absurd in hindsight. Sweden in particular? Sure, despite what the media was trying to sell, all of the scandanavian countries had similar strategies and (including sweden) ended up faring better than the average european country. So I wouldn't say Sweden specifically, because that's just a political hot topic. Norway, which also didn't actually lock down (just look at oxfords covid stringency index if you don't believe me) did very well. I suspect you're asking what would I have done at the time, though, and I think at the time the most practical approach was Korea's contact tracing and just like we've done for as long as I've been alive, staying at home would be something recommended for the sick. Lock downs were at no point in the pandemic a reasonable strategy, not even explicitly in the context of saving our healthcare system. Just look at how many hospitals have gone bankrupt and had to lay off huge amounts of staff. Our hospital system suffered the most because of lockdowns, not because of covid.
  - svnt 3y ago
    Your reasoning seems a bit odd. The hospitals are laying off because they overstaffed out of fear of not being able to handle the demands of the pandemic. Now that the pandemic is gone they cannot economically support the headcount. If we had not locked down many many more people would have died, and the health care system would have actually broken down. You’re saying that we should have not locked down and just staffed the crematoriums instead?

by toolz 3y ago

svnt 3y ago

I guess I’m not sure what your implied alternative is to the “Chinese Model” which I don’t think anyone can credibly say we accurately emulated — what would you have preferred we do and whose model would that have been? Sweden’s?

toolz 3y ago
Today? It should go without saying we shouldn't have locked down. Somehow there are still people holding onto the idea it was a justified measure, but what we know today simply makes that option look absurd in hindsight. Sweden in particular? Sure, despite what the media was trying to sell, all of the scandanavian countries had similar strategies and (including sweden) ended up faring better than the average european country. So I wouldn't say Sweden specifically, because that's just a political hot topic. Norway, which also didn't actually lock down (just look at oxfords covid stringency index if you don't believe me) did very well. I suspect you're asking what would I have done at the time, though, and I think at the time the most practical approach was Korea's contact tracing and just like we've done for as long as I've been alive, staying at home would be something recommended for the sick. Lock downs were at no point in the pandemic a reasonable strategy, not even explicitly in the context of saving our healthcare system. Just look at how many hospitals have gone bankrupt and had to lay off huge amounts of staff. Our hospital system suffered the most because of lockdowns, not because of covid.
- svnt 3y ago
  Your reasoning seems a bit odd. The hospitals are laying off because they overstaffed out of fear of not being able to handle the demands of the pandemic. Now that the pandemic is gone they cannot economically support the headcount. If we had not locked down many many more people would have died, and the health care system would have actually broken down. You’re saying that we should have not locked down and just staffed the crematoriums instead?