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> With costs for solar/wind/storage dropping every year, isn't it time to give up on this pipe dream? When will we give up the pipedream that it's always going

> With costs for solar/wind/storage dropping every year, isn't it time to give up on this pipe dream? When will we give up the pipedream that it's always going to be sunny and windy, especially as climate change continues to exacerbate destructive weather patterns. And when will we give up the pipedream that everywhere in the world is sunny and windy all the time to.

rgmerk 3y ago
The question is whether one or more of the seasonal storage technologies on the horizon, when combined with the seasonal storage we already have (conventional hydropower with big honking dams) turns out to give a cheaper electricity system cost than nuclear in a given location. Also worth pointing out that a large fraction of the world’s population lives in places where seasonal storage is not nearly as much of a problem. Seasonal storage is much more of an issue for cool temperate and subarctic zones in the northern hemisphere, where maximum energy demand and minimum solar energy supply occur at the same time. Several billion people across South Asia, south-east Asia, most of South America, Oceania, and most of Africa don’t have this unfortunate misalignment.
- ekianjo 3y ago
  People dont deem to realize that dams are super expensive, dont last forever and can cause cataclismic failures when they break. Stuff that is much worse that nuclear failures. And lets not talk about the destruction of human and animal habitat to make dams in the first place...
  - rgmerk 3y ago
    True, but we already have quite a lot of them, and we’re not going to remove them all immediately.
    - lazide 3y ago
      Most places already have built dams where there is any significant economic value. The only big new ones tend to be in newly developing areas. So not much opportunity to expand there.
tstrimple 3y ago
> When will we give up the pipedream that it's always going to be sunny and windy Nuclear proponents really need to give up these tired arguments. Wake up to reality. Your favored technology lost. It has zero economic benefits and you have to face reality. We live in a profit driven world, and no sane profit driven enterprise would bet on nuclear power because it's been proven to be such a loser decade after decade. The evidence is plain to see for anyone willing to take a look.
- ekianjo 3y ago
  China is building nuclear plants at a record pace. Are you saying they are full of shit and dont understand economics?
  - tstrimple 3y ago
    Is China a profit driven society or do they have a command economy? Do you even understand the basics of politics and what it takes to enact certain things in different countries with different political systems and motivations? China also added more solar capacity last year than the entire US solar capacity. Why is it your support for China policies only extends to your fondness for 1950's science fiction? China's Covid crackdowns were effective in slowing the spread of the disease through their populations and saves potentially millions of lives because of it. Should we be welding people into their apartment buildings or are you willing to admit that different governments tackle problems differently and one solution can't be applied universally? By the way, even accounting for China's recent investment in nuclear they are only projecting to have 10% of their power generated by nuclear by 2050. The US is already close to 20%, or twice as much as China as a percentage of power generated. But sure, let's just keep pretending these situations are the same.
- g8oz 3y ago
  The true believers don't want to hear it. You can show example after example of projects gone comically over budget and over schedule and none of it will really register.

rgmerk 3y ago

The question is whether one or more of the seasonal storage technologies on the horizon, when combined with the seasonal storage we already have (conventional hydropower with big honking dams) turns out to give a cheaper electricity system cost than nuclear in a given location. Also worth pointing out that a large fraction of the world’s population lives in places where seasonal storage is not nearly as much of a problem. Seasonal storage is much more of an issue for cool temperate and subarctic zones in the northern hemisphere, where maximum energy demand and minimum solar energy supply occur at the same time. Several billion people across South Asia, south-east Asia, most of South America, Oceania, and most of Africa don’t have this unfortunate misalignment.

ekianjo 3y ago
People dont deem to realize that dams are super expensive, dont last forever and can cause cataclismic failures when they break. Stuff that is much worse that nuclear failures. And lets not talk about the destruction of human and animal habitat to make dams in the first place...
- rgmerk 3y ago
  True, but we already have quite a lot of them, and we’re not going to remove them all immediately.
  - lazide 3y ago
    Most places already have built dams where there is any significant economic value. The only big new ones tend to be in newly developing areas. So not much opportunity to expand there.

tstrimple 3y ago

> When will we give up the pipedream that it's always going to be sunny and windy Nuclear proponents really need to give up these tired arguments. Wake up to reality. Your favored technology lost. It has zero economic benefits and you have to face reality. We live in a profit driven world, and no sane profit driven enterprise would bet on nuclear power because it's been proven to be such a loser decade after decade. The evidence is plain to see for anyone willing to take a look.

ekianjo 3y ago
China is building nuclear plants at a record pace. Are you saying they are full of shit and dont understand economics?
- tstrimple 3y ago
  Is China a profit driven society or do they have a command economy? Do you even understand the basics of politics and what it takes to enact certain things in different countries with different political systems and motivations? China also added more solar capacity last year than the entire US solar capacity. Why is it your support for China policies only extends to your fondness for 1950's science fiction? China's Covid crackdowns were effective in slowing the spread of the disease through their populations and saves potentially millions of lives because of it. Should we be welding people into their apartment buildings or are you willing to admit that different governments tackle problems differently and one solution can't be applied universally? By the way, even accounting for China's recent investment in nuclear they are only projecting to have 10% of their power generated by nuclear by 2050. The US is already close to 20%, or twice as much as China as a percentage of power generated. But sure, let's just keep pretending these situations are the same.
g8oz 3y ago
The true believers don't want to hear it. You can show example after example of projects gone comically over budget and over schedule and none of it will really register.