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Did you know that a heat pump can generate 4 times as much heat per unit energy than an electric heater?

by jahnu 3y ago

agilob 3y ago
Property management company forbids any such installations. It's my flat, but we're not allowed to drill any holes in bricks or ceiling. I moved out from that flat, now live in a house that has a geothermal heat pump. 4 times bigger house, 3x lower bill...
- deleted 3y ago
  [deleted]
- Aachen 3y ago
  That's not your flat
- jahnu 3y ago
  Sounds bad. I hope they change their rules to allow upgrading to heat pumps one day.
  - agilob 3y ago
    That's how leasehold and property management works in the UK. I paid off the mortgage completely: bought the flat. Yet I'm not allowed to eg. better insulate walls, the attic belongs to me, the roof doesn't. If I wanted to replace windows, I would need to pay £100 application fee and justify it. Then the property management company sends their guy "who knows the job" who I pay THEIR AGREED price to replace the windows. Whole process take about 5 months and 3 weeks. Apparently, this is normal with FirstPort. If you want to buy a flat, you either agree to their rules or don't buy a flat. Changing the property management company is close to impossible. I fought many battles with them, all lost.
- scythe 3y ago
  A sensible legal reform would be to establish that property managers and other private busybodies can't ban any reasonable energy-saving upgrades.
  - agilob 3y ago
    That's correct. I spent over a year trying to negotiate with them adding an external insulation because the flat has naked bricks. Their position was basically that they aren't legally forces to do so and finding a contractor is a lot of work.
dontlaugh 3y ago
That doesn't help much when electricity cost is 4-5x more per kWh. I can heat with either AC or gas, but the latter comes out cheaper.
- konschubert 3y ago
  But it isn’t.
  - dontlaugh 3y ago
    It's right there on my bill. This has been the typical price ratio in the UK for a while now.
- jahnu 3y ago
  It helps with carbon emissions though.
  - dontlaugh 3y ago
    Potentially, if electricity wasn't also often generated with gas. Also, why would I pay more to have less comfortable heating? Individual action like that does nothing. The solution is collective.
    - jahnu 3y ago
      I believe if the electricity is generated with gas it’s still less carbon intensive due to gas power plants being more efficient than gas heaters in homes.
      - dontlaugh 3y ago
        Sure, but condensing boilers are already 90% efficient. The difference will likely be lost in electricity transmission.
        jahnu 3y ago
giardini 3y ago
How much more does a heat pump installation cost? How many years before the heat pump pays for itself? I've got friends and family who installed solar panels a decade ago and claim they haven't "broken even" (the investment hasn't paid for itself) yet and that they may never b/c they're now facing maintenance, upgrades and/or replacement of old components. Also their insurance went up b/c of the solar installation (higher likelihood of roof damage, greater risk of fire, etc.) I'm a KISS (Keep It Simple, Stupid!) kinda guy and have remained unencumbered by these "social complexities" so far.
- lxgr 3y ago
  > How many years before the heat pump pays for itself? In most cases very few, given European electricity prices. The real problem is that it's usually not possible to just switch to a heat pump in an apartment building, and that's assuming you own and don't rent (and ownership is also much less common in many parts of Europe, although I think it's a bit higher in the UK).

Did you know that a heat pump can generate 4 times as much heat per unit energy than an electric heater?

by jahnu 3y ago

Did you know that a heat pump can generate 4 times as much heat per unit energy than an electric heater?

Property management company forbids any such installations. It's my flat, but we're not allowed to drill any holes in bricks or ceiling. I moved out from that flat, now live in a house that has a geothermal heat pump. 4 times bigger house, 3x lower bill...

deleted 3y ago
[deleted]
Aachen 3y ago
That's not your flat
jahnu 3y ago
Sounds bad. I hope they change their rules to allow upgrading to heat pumps one day.
- agilob 3y ago
  That's how leasehold and property management works in the UK. I paid off the mortgage completely: bought the flat. Yet I'm not allowed to eg. better insulate walls, the attic belongs to me, the roof doesn't. If I wanted to replace windows, I would need to pay £100 application fee and justify it. Then the property management company sends their guy "who knows the job" who I pay THEIR AGREED price to replace the windows. Whole process take about 5 months and 3 weeks. Apparently, this is normal with FirstPort. If you want to buy a flat, you either agree to their rules or don't buy a flat. Changing the property management company is close to impossible. I fought many battles with them, all lost.
scythe 3y ago
A sensible legal reform would be to establish that property managers and other private busybodies can't ban any reasonable energy-saving upgrades.
- agilob 3y ago
  That's correct. I spent over a year trying to negotiate with them adding an external insulation because the flat has naked bricks. Their position was basically that they aren't legally forces to do so and finding a contractor is a lot of work.

dontlaugh 3y ago

That doesn't help much when electricity cost is 4-5x more per kWh. I can heat with either AC or gas, but the latter comes out cheaper.

konschubert 3y ago
But it isn’t.
- dontlaugh 3y ago
  It's right there on my bill. This has been the typical price ratio in the UK for a while now.
jahnu 3y ago
It helps with carbon emissions though.
- dontlaugh 3y ago
  Potentially, if electricity wasn't also often generated with gas. Also, why would I pay more to have less comfortable heating? Individual action like that does nothing. The solution is collective.
  - jahnu 3y ago
    I believe if the electricity is generated with gas it’s still less carbon intensive due to gas power plants being more efficient than gas heaters in homes.
    - dontlaugh 3y ago
      Sure, but condensing boilers are already 90% efficient. The difference will likely be lost in electricity transmission.
      - jahnu 3y ago

giardini 3y ago

How much more does a heat pump installation cost? How many years before the heat pump pays for itself? I've got friends and family who installed solar panels a decade ago and claim they haven't "broken even" (the investment hasn't paid for itself) yet and that they may never b/c they're now facing maintenance, upgrades and/or replacement of old components. Also their insurance went up b/c of the solar installation (higher likelihood of roof damage, greater risk of fire, etc.) I'm a KISS (Keep It Simple, Stupid!) kinda guy and have remained unencumbered by these "social complexities" so far.

lxgr 3y ago
> How many years before the heat pump pays for itself? In most cases very few, given European electricity prices. The real problem is that it's usually not possible to just switch to a heat pump in an apartment building, and that's assuming you own and don't rent (and ownership is also much less common in many parts of Europe, although I think it's a bit higher in the UK).