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High Pirate Party Numbers = 4 more years for Angela Merkel I welcome the German pirates for several reasons: - "the discussion it brought up is already very b

High Pirate Party Numbers = 4 more years for Angela Merkel I welcome the German pirates for several reasons: - "the discussion it brought up is already very beneficial." - they have a high turn out of former non-voters - "harmless stupidity": The German pirates seem to be ambivalent as of now. For instance, they are the only left-wing party that's not in favor of female employee quotas (an idea so absurd, there's not even an english wikipedia entry http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frauenquote http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frauenquote). If they dig deeper into this populist lefty anti-authoritarian theme (as it seems to be the case) the first thing they will achieve is less votes for the other left-wing parties. And personally, I think this would be a good thing (see "female employee quotas").

philippK 15y ago
I think it's pretty unlikely that they fully get into all that "gender politics" stuff like the greens. That has several reasons - mainly the see themselves as more "liberal" (it has a different meaning here than in the us) than greens, and also they are not as female-dominated in their ranks as greens are. I think it's unlikely that they'll embrace a full blown "Frauenquote" (funny how there isn't an english wikipedia entry for it ^^), because the discussion inside the party (i am not a member) seems to be going in a direction they call "post gender". I think this post gender idead, by and large, is a good one. I hope they'll pursue this path more, bringing an approach of true equality to politics instead of the "gender fights" other left-leaning parties like to put on the political stage.
rmc 15y ago
female employee quotas an idea so absurd, there's not even an english wikipedia entry http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Women_in_government#Quotas http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Women_in_government#Quotas
cabalamat 15y ago
> High Pirate Party Numbers = 4 more years for Angela Merkel How does that follow?
- brazzy 15y ago
  Because the Pirate party is taking away voters from both the traditional conservative camp (FDP, CDU/CSU) and the traditional social democrat/Green camp, yet is too new to be seriously considered as a coalition partner for a government. That means a grand coalition (CDU/CSU and SPD) led by Merkel becomes more likely - the same one as in the previous administration, before the FDP gained enough votes to have a traditional conservative coalition, but the FDP is currently vanishing into obscurity.
  - cabalamat 15y ago
    That makes sense. It would also possibly the best outcome for the Pirates: being in opposition would give them time to be more professional and get their act together, and would mean that in the next elections, both CDU and SPD would be unpopular incumbents (meaning they both lose more votes to the Pirates).
    - philippK 15y ago
      Absolutely. Entering a government after they first get into the parliament would do them no good. They first need to establish themselves, before they can govern.
  - LinaLauneBaer 15y ago
    Shouldn't everyone just vote for the party who he likes most? Voting for a party has also long-term effects that you have to consider. Also in Germany every party gets money for each vote and so on... the coalition aspect is just one of many...
  - nickik 15y ago
    Does anybody know enougth about the Swiss and German system that can explain to me why we never here the term "coalition" in swiss politics? If you are in the parlament you are in it. I mean there is stuff to vote on and everybody votes for what he likes what effects does not been in "the coalition" have? I hope I made myself clear.
ZeroGravitas 15y ago
How is Frauenquote different from Affirmitive Action? (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Affirmative_action http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Affirmative_action)
- deleted 15y ago
  [deleted]
- philippK 15y ago
  Reading the entry - it isn't. It's basically the same thing. What is different in germany, though, is that the discussion here revolves around forcing private sector enterprises to have specific (government set) quota of women in their leadership (or else be punished by the law). Affirmative action in the US seems to revolve more around not negatively discriminating against women when making hiring decisions, but not forcing government set quotas on companies. I can't quite imagine the US government interfering with private enterprise in this way.
  - roel_v 15y ago
    "Affirmative action in the US seems to revolve more around not negatively discriminating against women when making hiring decisions," Affirmative action is when two people are equally suited for a job/position/benefit, the one from the disadvantaged group (based on sex, ethnic/socioeconomic background, physical impairment, ...) gets it. In more extreme varieties, it means that the one from the disadvantaged group has less strict requirements to fulfill. In a way, a women's quota is a species of the genus affirmative action.
grepherder 15y ago
"Frauenquote" is just a specialization of the term "positive discrimination" in the UK, France, Spain and in most of the EU, and "affirmative action" in the US and some other countries. Other countries do not have a specific term for the gender case, but it is exactly the same thing, and lots of similar policies exist. You can see this by taking a look at Wikipedia/Quotenregelung which is linked to Affirmative action in English Wikipedia. About the Pirate Party's take on this: I don't think there's a mature consensus yet. According to a recent poll (http://www.taz.de/!89247/ http://www.taz.de/!89247/) only 6 percent sees the party as postgender.

philippK 15y ago

I think it's pretty unlikely that they fully get into all that "gender politics" stuff like the greens. That has several reasons - mainly the see themselves as more "liberal" (it has a different meaning here than in the us) than greens, and also they are not as female-dominated in their ranks as greens are. I think it's unlikely that they'll embrace a full blown "Frauenquote" (funny how there isn't an english wikipedia entry for it ^^), because the discussion inside the party (i am not a member) seems to be going in a direction they call "post gender". I think this post gender idead, by and large, is a good one. I hope they'll pursue this path more, bringing an approach of true equality to politics instead of the "gender fights" other left-leaning parties like to put on the political stage.

rmc 15y ago

female employee quotas an idea so absurd, there's not even an english wikipedia entry http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Women_in_government#Quotas http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Women_in_government#Quotas

cabalamat 15y ago

> High Pirate Party Numbers = 4 more years for Angela Merkel How does that follow?

brazzy 15y ago
Because the Pirate party is taking away voters from both the traditional conservative camp (FDP, CDU/CSU) and the traditional social democrat/Green camp, yet is too new to be seriously considered as a coalition partner for a government. That means a grand coalition (CDU/CSU and SPD) led by Merkel becomes more likely - the same one as in the previous administration, before the FDP gained enough votes to have a traditional conservative coalition, but the FDP is currently vanishing into obscurity.
- cabalamat 15y ago
  That makes sense. It would also possibly the best outcome for the Pirates: being in opposition would give them time to be more professional and get their act together, and would mean that in the next elections, both CDU and SPD would be unpopular incumbents (meaning they both lose more votes to the Pirates).
  - philippK 15y ago
    Absolutely. Entering a government after they first get into the parliament would do them no good. They first need to establish themselves, before they can govern.
- LinaLauneBaer 15y ago
  Shouldn't everyone just vote for the party who he likes most? Voting for a party has also long-term effects that you have to consider. Also in Germany every party gets money for each vote and so on... the coalition aspect is just one of many...
- nickik 15y ago
  Does anybody know enougth about the Swiss and German system that can explain to me why we never here the term "coalition" in swiss politics? If you are in the parlament you are in it. I mean there is stuff to vote on and everybody votes for what he likes what effects does not been in "the coalition" have? I hope I made myself clear.

ZeroGravitas 15y ago

How is Frauenquote different from Affirmitive Action? (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Affirmative_action http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Affirmative_action)

deleted 15y ago
[deleted]
philippK 15y ago
Reading the entry - it isn't. It's basically the same thing. What is different in germany, though, is that the discussion here revolves around forcing private sector enterprises to have specific (government set) quota of women in their leadership (or else be punished by the law). Affirmative action in the US seems to revolve more around not negatively discriminating against women when making hiring decisions, but not forcing government set quotas on companies. I can't quite imagine the US government interfering with private enterprise in this way.
- roel_v 15y ago
  "Affirmative action in the US seems to revolve more around not negatively discriminating against women when making hiring decisions," Affirmative action is when two people are equally suited for a job/position/benefit, the one from the disadvantaged group (based on sex, ethnic/socioeconomic background, physical impairment, ...) gets it. In more extreme varieties, it means that the one from the disadvantaged group has less strict requirements to fulfill. In a way, a women's quota is a species of the genus affirmative action.

grepherder 15y ago

"Frauenquote" is just a specialization of the term "positive discrimination" in the UK, France, Spain and in most of the EU, and "affirmative action" in the US and some other countries. Other countries do not have a specific term for the gender case, but it is exactly the same thing, and lots of similar policies exist. You can see this by taking a look at Wikipedia/Quotenregelung which is linked to Affirmative action in English Wikipedia. About the Pirate Party's take on this: I don't think there's a mature consensus yet. According to a recent poll (http://www.taz.de/!89247/ http://www.taz.de/!89247/) only 6 percent sees the party as postgender.