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I was talking to my girlfriend about the concept of banning things deemed harmful last night. The conversation started around whether it's a good idea to ban pe

by kypro 3y ago

I was talking to my girlfriend about the concept of banning things deemed harmful last night. The conversation started around whether it's a good idea to ban people doing things that are dangerous to themselves (like smoking and drinking), but obviously it's hard to have that conversation without also considering broader societal consequences. Something I've noticed in recent years is how out of touch I am about the harms people claim are caused to them by social media. For example, I find Twitter to be an amazing source of real-time information and a place I can discuss practically any topic with experts in that field. I don't post on there but I have TikTok on my phone and I find it quite a fun app to use to pass the time when I have nothing else to do. I think because of my viewing habits I tend to get fairly interesting DIY, tech and political content show up which can sometimes teach me something I didn't know. Sometimes the content is lacking depth, but it's certainly not a negative experience. The same is true of me and alcohol or smoking. I don't drink or smoke. I actually had my first drink in about 3 years the other day, but it was something I wanted to do to maximise my enjoyment of the situation. Similarly, I have smoked a few times in my life, but it's only ever been a positive experience given the context. I think what troubles me when I speak to people about these topics is that most people feel they're victims of social media and other potentially harmful things like smoking and alcohol and therefore support bans. Obviously I can't deny these things can and do have negative impacts on individuals and societies, but I'd question whether they are the root cause. There seems to be a larger issue here around people lacking self-control and self-awareness, therefore wanting the government to impose the self-control they lack on them. And I think this problem is getting worse just observing how teens today use social media. I'm saying this because I think TikTok could be a positive force in society, but it's not because a large number of people today are incapable of self-control. And this is a problem because if the root issue isn't TikTok but our own self-control then we'll need to demand our government take ever more control over our lives to protect us from ourselves. For example if the government doesn't regulate my use of Twitter or out right ban me using it then I might develop an addiction to it and anxiety. If the government doesn't stop me from smoking then it's possible I might smoke a pack a day for the next decade then go on to develop lung cancer. If the government doesn't ban me from drinking sugary drinks then I might drink a can of Coca-Cola. I've flippantly joked about it before, but I do think if we can't address this underlying issue of self-control we will have to extend these bans further and further to places which seem absurd today. For example, hard to argue someone watching TikTok every day is more harmful than someone eating at McDonalds every day. Given the harms of fast food I think you could make a far stronger argument against it's legality than TikTok. I understand I'm expressing an unpopular opinion here. I'm also not saying there's nothing we can do to reduce the likelihood that people will develop harmful behaviours. For example, I wouldn't necessarily be against reasonable restrictions on social media for children. It's really this idea that adults can't choose to do things which could be harmful to themselves that I find hard to understand.

bobsmooth 3y ago
>It's really this idea that adults can't choose to do things which could be harmful to themselves that I find hard to understand. I really think it comes to down to a simple distinction: those that grew up with the old internet as kids and were inoculated to its effects and those that first got the internet through the main line that is the smartphone.
- kombookcha 3y ago
  I think growing up with a smartphone in your hand makes you extremely well attuned to presentation and sensing how every little data point will be perceived by others. Maybe you need that to navigate today. But I think that acute awareness also comes with a sense that there are currents dragging and pulling at you, which older generations are less perceptive of, and perhaps less vulnerable to. We now have a generation who had to form their sense of self in a world where they are surrounded by sophisticated social media algorithms. They didn't get to form a sense of self offline, and only then hit the information superhighway where you pick out the perfect TOOL-song for your MySpace. They had to swim or sink - and they're really good swimmers now, but perhaps on some level they accurately feel like they were robbed of a choice of sorts. You'll never know who you would have been without the smartphone.
- kypro 3y ago
  There's always been something like the internet though. When I was growing up there was a lot of concern around video games, for example. Growing up I even knew a few guys who were arguably addicted to video games and did nothing else when they weren't in school but play video games. Video games are also designed to be addictive and can often have harmful content – this is the main reason parents wanted certain video games banned in the 90s. Again, I'm not against sensible limits on children. I do understand that a child cannot have 100% agency over their own actions. But blanket bans on "harmful" videos games like GTA or apps like TikTok seems silly because it limits the actions of adults under the assumption that the government knows what's best for you and your family. What the government could do is implement age restrictions and age-based content filters. Mandate that companies provide parents with the tools to restrict usage and fine companies that fail do to this. But otherwise just let people do what they want. Tiktok is a great app enjoyed by millions. I don't know why we have to ruin that because a small percentage of people can't control their usage.

by kypro 3y ago

bobsmooth 3y ago

>It's really this idea that adults can't choose to do things which could be harmful to themselves that I find hard to understand. I really think it comes to down to a simple distinction: those that grew up with the old internet as kids and were inoculated to its effects and those that first got the internet through the main line that is the smartphone.

kombookcha 3y ago
I think growing up with a smartphone in your hand makes you extremely well attuned to presentation and sensing how every little data point will be perceived by others. Maybe you need that to navigate today. But I think that acute awareness also comes with a sense that there are currents dragging and pulling at you, which older generations are less perceptive of, and perhaps less vulnerable to. We now have a generation who had to form their sense of self in a world where they are surrounded by sophisticated social media algorithms. They didn't get to form a sense of self offline, and only then hit the information superhighway where you pick out the perfect TOOL-song for your MySpace. They had to swim or sink - and they're really good swimmers now, but perhaps on some level they accurately feel like they were robbed of a choice of sorts. You'll never know who you would have been without the smartphone.
kypro 3y ago
There's always been something like the internet though. When I was growing up there was a lot of concern around video games, for example. Growing up I even knew a few guys who were arguably addicted to video games and did nothing else when they weren't in school but play video games. Video games are also designed to be addictive and can often have harmful content – this is the main reason parents wanted certain video games banned in the 90s. Again, I'm not against sensible limits on children. I do understand that a child cannot have 100% agency over their own actions. But blanket bans on "harmful" videos games like GTA or apps like TikTok seems silly because it limits the actions of adults under the assumption that the government knows what's best for you and your family. What the government could do is implement age restrictions and age-based content filters. Mandate that companies provide parents with the tools to restrict usage and fine companies that fail do to this. But otherwise just let people do what they want. Tiktok is a great app enjoyed by millions. I don't know why we have to ruin that because a small percentage of people can't control their usage.