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> wear on the brakes Biggest complain about breaks in EVs I have read about is that they rust from non usage >Lights burn out and need replacing. With LEDs t

> wear on the brakes Biggest complain about breaks in EVs I have read about is that they rust from non usage >Lights burn out and need replacing. With LEDs this is a non issue, even for gas cars for years. > EV battery needs to be replaced, which is expensive. We are talking 300k miles+ on somewhat modern batteries, 1 million miles+ for lfp most gas cars are long dead at this point And EVs are still usable, also you might need to charge them more often(yes some gas cars can go longer, but you often need a transmission rebuild + expensive repair in the motor) >Hertz recently said that maintaining a Tesla costs more than an ICE I would assume that's through the added collisions damages you have on rentals, but afaik there was no data published here

rasz 3y ago
Problem with LED lights is they are made as a big unrepairable blobs, and Car manufacturers love overcharging for bespoke parts https://www.carscoops.com/2022/10/gmc-hummers-taillights-will-cost-you-more-than-a-new-motorcycle/ https://www.carscoops.com/2022/10/gmc-hummers-taillights-wil...
- pinkgolem 3y ago
  Fully agree with that, an repairability is a big issue with some players like Tesla, also because there are no 3d party spare parts Still, from a maintance standpoints... LEDs are great as a good implementation needs to only be changed after an incident
eesmith 3y ago
Tesla recommends "cleaning and lubricating all brake calipers every 12 months or 12,500 mi for vehicles in cold weather regions" and "testing your brake fluid for contamination every 2 years". https://www.tesla.com/support/vehicle-maintenance https://www.tesla.com/support/vehicle-maintenance That is regular maintenance. My main point - which I did not express well - is 'maintenance' should be the issue, not just routine maintenance. This break, and need to be fixed. Regarding Hertz, a news article at https://www.businessinsider.com/hertz-slows-down-electric-plans-tesla-2023-10?op=1&r=US&IR=T https://www.businessinsider.com/hertz-slows-down-electric-pl... summarizes it as: > Hertz said the company found that repairing damage to an electric car can cost around twice as much as fixing similar issues on a comparable internal-combustion-engine vehicle. Routine maintenance, however, costs less, the company said. EVs don't need oil changes and are generally simpler to maintain than internal-combustion vehicles. I am also aware that is Tesla-specific, and may not apply to other EVs. However, it still does not mean that one can say something is an EV therefore it must be easier to maintain than an ICE, if only because the latter has spent a lot more money over the last century to reduce those costs.
- pinkgolem 3y ago
  Great straw man, no one said ev's need no maintenance.. just that regular maintainance is a lot, lot less then on ice car and that car dealerships are suffering under that. Having the option to do a, what amounts to an underside car cleaning is not really a counter argument to that point
  - eesmith 3y ago
    I think you're right, and I've stayed up too late.
JohnFen 3y ago
> With LEDs this is a non issue, even for gas cars for years. The numerous faulty LED signal & brake lights I see on the road say otherwise.
- pinkgolem 3y ago
  I would be really surprised if those are burned out and not simply people not blinking + dumb Breaklight Software. The whole regeneration breaking + breaklights is really badly regulated & implemented in a ton of cars. But might be wrong, might be they keep burning up in your climate.
  - JohnFen 3y ago
    I'm not talking about the lights just not working at all (mostly -- but I do see plenty of LED brakelights that are out on one side only), I'm talking about sections of the lights being out, or flickering wildly. It's certainly not a problem with the LEDs themselves, but with the power or control circuitry. But, just like how it's rarely the LEDs themselves that have failed when your LED lightbulb stops working, the end result is that it's broken anyway and so needs repair. I see more broken LED lights than broken old-style lights, but that may be because there are more of them on the road now. I don't know what the percentage failure rate is between the two. Interestingly, years ago when stoplights were being replaced with LED versions, almost all of them would begin exhibiting similar failures within weeks of installation. That seems to have been fixed now -- I rarely see malfunctioning stoplights anymore. So perhaps cars will catch up to that standard.
    - pinkgolem 3y ago
      Interesting that our experiences differ so much. Are you in an high heat/humidity market? Or might just be some producer which don't have a big market share in Germany. Can't find data on this case. Had hope the German tüv would go into failure statistics, but nothing.

rasz 3y ago

Problem with LED lights is they are made as a big unrepairable blobs, and Car manufacturers love overcharging for bespoke parts https://www.carscoops.com/2022/10/gmc-hummers-taillights-will-cost-you-more-than-a-new-motorcycle/ https://www.carscoops.com/2022/10/gmc-hummers-taillights-wil...

pinkgolem 3y ago
Fully agree with that, an repairability is a big issue with some players like Tesla, also because there are no 3d party spare parts Still, from a maintance standpoints... LEDs are great as a good implementation needs to only be changed after an incident

eesmith 3y ago

Tesla recommends "cleaning and lubricating all brake calipers every 12 months or 12,500 mi for vehicles in cold weather regions" and "testing your brake fluid for contamination every 2 years". https://www.tesla.com/support/vehicle-maintenance https://www.tesla.com/support/vehicle-maintenance That is regular maintenance. My main point - which I did not express well - is 'maintenance' should be the issue, not just routine maintenance. This break, and need to be fixed. Regarding Hertz, a news article at https://www.businessinsider.com/hertz-slows-down-electric-plans-tesla-2023-10?op=1&r=US&IR=T https://www.businessinsider.com/hertz-slows-down-electric-pl... summarizes it as: > Hertz said the company found that repairing damage to an electric car can cost around twice as much as fixing similar issues on a comparable internal-combustion-engine vehicle. Routine maintenance, however, costs less, the company said. EVs don't need oil changes and are generally simpler to maintain than internal-combustion vehicles. I am also aware that is Tesla-specific, and may not apply to other EVs. However, it still does not mean that one can say something is an EV therefore it must be easier to maintain than an ICE, if only because the latter has spent a lot more money over the last century to reduce those costs.

pinkgolem 3y ago
Great straw man, no one said ev's need no maintenance.. just that regular maintainance is a lot, lot less then on ice car and that car dealerships are suffering under that. Having the option to do a, what amounts to an underside car cleaning is not really a counter argument to that point
- eesmith 3y ago
  I think you're right, and I've stayed up too late.

JohnFen 3y ago

> With LEDs this is a non issue, even for gas cars for years. The numerous faulty LED signal & brake lights I see on the road say otherwise.

pinkgolem 3y ago
I would be really surprised if those are burned out and not simply people not blinking + dumb Breaklight Software. The whole regeneration breaking + breaklights is really badly regulated & implemented in a ton of cars. But might be wrong, might be they keep burning up in your climate.
- JohnFen 3y ago
  I'm not talking about the lights just not working at all (mostly -- but I do see plenty of LED brakelights that are out on one side only), I'm talking about sections of the lights being out, or flickering wildly. It's certainly not a problem with the LEDs themselves, but with the power or control circuitry. But, just like how it's rarely the LEDs themselves that have failed when your LED lightbulb stops working, the end result is that it's broken anyway and so needs repair. I see more broken LED lights than broken old-style lights, but that may be because there are more of them on the road now. I don't know what the percentage failure rate is between the two. Interestingly, years ago when stoplights were being replaced with LED versions, almost all of them would begin exhibiting similar failures within weeks of installation. That seems to have been fixed now -- I rarely see malfunctioning stoplights anymore. So perhaps cars will catch up to that standard.
  - pinkgolem 3y ago
    Interesting that our experiences differ so much. Are you in an high heat/humidity market? Or might just be some producer which don't have a big market share in Germany. Can't find data on this case. Had hope the German tüv would go into failure statistics, but nothing.