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> capitalism is private ownership of property Not only is that not my personal definition of the term, but that isn't how it's defined in the linked article; n

> capitalism is private ownership of property Not only is that not my personal definition of the term, but that isn't how it's defined in the linked article; nor is Yannis Varoufakis even remotely advocating eliminating the notion of private property ownership. > capitalism is not just "free market economy," where the natural opposite as you supoose being "centrally planned economies" That depends entirely on who you ask. You'll get very different, but equally sincere and well-justified, definitions from your local college's student socialist societ compared to the parents of the members of the lacrosse team. Once anyone conversation starts using either C-word it inevitably turns into "Capitalism is anything I don't like" vs. "Communism is anything I don't like" and it's all downhill from there.

_oghd 3y ago
> nor is Yannis Varoufakis even remotely advocating eliminating the notion of private property ownership. uh, yes, he does. > I try to create a vision of a liberal, socialist society that is not based on private property but does use money as a vehicle for exchange and markets as coordinating devices. I preserve money and markets because the alternative would be to fall to some fearsome hierarchical control, which, for me, is a nightmare scenario. https://greattransition.org/publication/another-europe-is-possible https://greattransition.org/publication/another-europe-is-po... whether you agree with Marx or not, his description of capitalism is at the very least, complete. and it's his definition I used.
- DaiPlusPlus 3y ago
  > uh, yes, he does. I clarify, I meant in the linked article; not an interview from years ago.
  - _oghd 3y ago
    in the original article.... I quote: >Towards the end of Technofeudalism, Varoufakis canvasses some proposals, drawn from his earlier book Another Now (2020), for how to address these issues. These include ending the cloudalists faux “free service” model and replacing it with a universal micro-payment model, instituting a Bill of Digital Rights, and using digital technology to “democratise companies” (with decisions being taken collectively by “employee-shareholders”) employee owned coops are a major socialist idea, and are a definitive step away from privately owned capital, toward collectively owned production by the employees (proletariat, if you will). so, yes. he does. in this article.
    - DaiPlusPlus 3y ago
      When you talk of abolishing "private property" ownership that wasn't what I had in mind; instead, peoples' minds immediately jump to an image of a state-sanctioned jackbooted thug taking away my GameBoy... and I'm pretty confident Yannis isn't advocating for that.
      - cassianoleal 3y ago
        That's because no one advocates for that. When communists talk about ending private property, it's specifically about the means of production. Your GameBoy, as well as your car, your house, your bed, your computer, etc. are personal property and nobody wants to take that away from you.

_oghd 3y ago

> nor is Yannis Varoufakis even remotely advocating eliminating the notion of private property ownership. uh, yes, he does. > I try to create a vision of a liberal, socialist society that is not based on private property but does use money as a vehicle for exchange and markets as coordinating devices. I preserve money and markets because the alternative would be to fall to some fearsome hierarchical control, which, for me, is a nightmare scenario. https://greattransition.org/publication/another-europe-is-possible https://greattransition.org/publication/another-europe-is-po... whether you agree with Marx or not, his description of capitalism is at the very least, complete. and it's his definition I used.

DaiPlusPlus 3y ago
> uh, yes, he does. I clarify, I meant in the linked article; not an interview from years ago.
- _oghd 3y ago
  in the original article.... I quote: >Towards the end of Technofeudalism, Varoufakis canvasses some proposals, drawn from his earlier book Another Now (2020), for how to address these issues. These include ending the cloudalists faux “free service” model and replacing it with a universal micro-payment model, instituting a Bill of Digital Rights, and using digital technology to “democratise companies” (with decisions being taken collectively by “employee-shareholders”) employee owned coops are a major socialist idea, and are a definitive step away from privately owned capital, toward collectively owned production by the employees (proletariat, if you will). so, yes. he does. in this article.
  - DaiPlusPlus 3y ago
    When you talk of abolishing "private property" ownership that wasn't what I had in mind; instead, peoples' minds immediately jump to an image of a state-sanctioned jackbooted thug taking away my GameBoy... and I'm pretty confident Yannis isn't advocating for that.
    - cassianoleal 3y ago
      That's because no one advocates for that. When communists talk about ending private property, it's specifically about the means of production. Your GameBoy, as well as your car, your house, your bed, your computer, etc. are personal property and nobody wants to take that away from you.