> I think the part you don't get is that clandestine arms of spy agencies are essentially state sponsored criminal agencies I'd go beyond that and say that the

> I think the part you don't get is that clandestine arms of spy agencies are essentially state sponsored criminal agencies I'd go beyond that and say that they are state sponsored terrorists, which is why I think it's obvious for the US to keep them away from their allies, unless their allies aren't really their allies. > Yes, but people don't bleed or die when threatened, so point still stands. I wouldn't be surprised if your state sponsored criminals have killed European citizens in order to bully people into submission, making them enact policies that then would lead to people dying... > Yes, but speaking of Ukraine, who is the main military support preventing a russian invasion? Speaking of Ukraine how did a government that provoked the Russians into attacking them come into power? > And do you recall trump being impeached over not helping Ukraine? Why would Trump be impeached over helping Ukraine? The US can't even protect it's own border. > Did the US owe them that? Well I suppose the US wouldn't want to have military bases that close to Moscow. > Who drew the maps in palestine? Brits! Who left sudan in shambles mixing christians and muslims in one country? That's right.. brits So you are saying that two wrongs make a right, and it's okay for the CIA to wiretap German politicians because brits did something bad decades earlier? > Stalin and Mak were arguably on the same murderous level as hitler and the japanese emperor. Way worse which is why I don't really like your Pax Americana argument, since it means justifying terrorizing innocent people for economical benefit, and then saying it's a good thing since the subjugated population can't resist any more and there'll be "peace". Either way you haven't managed to change my mind, and made me believe that its a good thing that the CIA wiretaps its allies and that it would make sense for European nations to start looking elsewhere for allies.