4 ms·

> This allows the speakers to be driven to much higher peak levels than the worst-case safe volume level, greatly extending their dynamic range. So software de

> This allows the speakers to be driven to much higher peak levels than the worst-case safe volume level, greatly extending their dynamic range. So software devs are going to drive the speakers past the worst-case safe volume level that was presumably set by hardware engineers? And they are going to do it with software running in a OS that isn't realtime safe? Anyone else see a problem here? Also-- does anyone know what Asahi is using to test the safety of what they're doing?

Zetobal 3y ago
You never overclocked a CPU when you were a youngling? For example I undervolt my CPU and GPU for lower noise and heat with just 2-3% loss in performance.
mort96 3y ago
What is your proposed alternative solution, given the constraint that without exceeding the guaranteed-safe volume levels, the speakers are garbage?
kalleboo 3y ago
That's how it works on macOS already, that's how these machines are designed to run.
CuriousCosmic 3y ago
> Anyone else see a problem here? No. The worst case safe volume levels are levels determined by the speaker manufactures that if you never exceed, you can never harm the hardware (due to overheating, etc). You can and should exceed those levels to use the hardware as it is intended by the manufacturers however if are doing so, you are now moving from a static system (one set of safe levels) to a dynamic system where the safe levels are determined by a multitude of variables and as such you need to have software or hardware monitoring those variables to keep the system within those safe bounds.
jakobson14 3y ago
Another person who doesn't understand a damn thing about why the safety daemon is needed or how it works. If you keep careful track of the audio going through the speakers and the energy in each frequency range, you can figure out exactly what the temperature is at any given moment and make sure it stays under the limit. However, this requires a ton of math. Alternatively, you can just put a hard cap on the volume, such that no combination of frequencies could ever overheat the speakers. This is safe, but sounds like crap. It's a far, far less nuanced way to do things and results in restricting how hard you can drive the speakers far more than is actually nesisary.
- jakobson14 3y ago
  Edit: looks like on the laptops the kernel has access to the actual I/V measurements (feed-back), but on imacs marcan'll have to instead rely on feed-forward looking at the audio signal.
kccqzy 3y ago
Here's an example of testing speakersafetyd: https://social.treehouse.systems/@marcan/111305404286878529 https://social.treehouse.systems/@marcan/111305404286878529 How it works with the kernel side of things: https://social.treehouse.systems/@marcan/111398084943456556 https://social.treehouse.systems/@marcan/111398084943456556

Zetobal 3y ago

You never overclocked a CPU when you were a youngling? For example I undervolt my CPU and GPU for lower noise and heat with just 2-3% loss in performance.

mort96 3y ago

What is your proposed alternative solution, given the constraint that without exceeding the guaranteed-safe volume levels, the speakers are garbage?

kalleboo 3y ago

That's how it works on macOS already, that's how these machines are designed to run.

CuriousCosmic 3y ago

> Anyone else see a problem here? No. The worst case safe volume levels are levels determined by the speaker manufactures that if you never exceed, you can never harm the hardware (due to overheating, etc). You can and should exceed those levels to use the hardware as it is intended by the manufacturers however if are doing so, you are now moving from a static system (one set of safe levels) to a dynamic system where the safe levels are determined by a multitude of variables and as such you need to have software or hardware monitoring those variables to keep the system within those safe bounds.

jakobson14 3y ago

Another person who doesn't understand a damn thing about why the safety daemon is needed or how it works. If you keep careful track of the audio going through the speakers and the energy in each frequency range, you can figure out exactly what the temperature is at any given moment and make sure it stays under the limit. However, this requires a ton of math. Alternatively, you can just put a hard cap on the volume, such that no combination of frequencies could ever overheat the speakers. This is safe, but sounds like crap. It's a far, far less nuanced way to do things and results in restricting how hard you can drive the speakers far more than is actually nesisary.

jakobson14 3y ago
Edit: looks like on the laptops the kernel has access to the actual I/V measurements (feed-back), but on imacs marcan'll have to instead rely on feed-forward looking at the audio signal.

kccqzy 3y ago

Here's an example of testing speakersafetyd: https://social.treehouse.systems/@marcan/111305404286878529 https://social.treehouse.systems/@marcan/111305404286878529 How it works with the kernel side of things: https://social.treehouse.systems/@marcan/111398084943456556 https://social.treehouse.systems/@marcan/111398084943456556