5 ms·

People still smoke cigarettes despite decades of clear evidence that they will lead to a horrible death in many cases. Society has built so many disincentives t

People still smoke cigarettes despite decades of clear evidence that they will lead to a horrible death in many cases. Society has built so many disincentives to doing so, and yet they persist. Animal products will continue to be consumed no matter how obvious it is that their production is morally repugnant and environmentally destructive. I am sorry to say that I am one of those consumers despite knowing better.

padjo 3y ago
As a former smoker and meat eater I know smoking was far far harder to give up than meat since there is a physical addiction component. Meat eating is just habit and something you can easily enough wean yourself away from.
- sigilis 3y ago
  It’s on the list of things I want to change about myself. I’m a work in progress. Dietary control is not something I have been able to exercise in the past. I’m attempting to obtain pharmaceutical help on that front, so maybe I will be able to execute on being a better person in that dimension in the coming months.
AlecSchueler 3y ago
Cigarette use is plummeting in the west.
- sigilis 3y ago
  Meat eating should also plummet if meat eating is banned in restaurants and there’s a minimum meat eating age that increases a year at a time. Bonus if there’s a health insurance question about meat eating and special meat taxes. There is no societal structure to disincentivize meat eating. Social pressure from vegetarians (which is so very slight) and logical arguments are the only thing we’ve got. Tradition, convenience, identity, and preferences are all arrayed against the reasonable thing. For now meat consumption is probably going to be somewhat inversely correlated to meat prices, as per usual.
  - padjo 3y ago
    In fairness it has been dropping, eg https://www.bbc.com/news/science-environment-58831636 https://www.bbc.com/news/science-environment-58831636 Here’s hoping a tipping point is reached soon
  - Scarblac 3y ago
    I'd expect change to come either from stronger regulation of agriculture that makes it much harder to produce meat, or if that's not introduced, from huge food shortages after desertification and other climate change effects become more pronounced. As long as meat is produced in sufficient quantity and at prices consumers can afford, I don't expect huge change from them.
  - hermitcrab 3y ago
    It is difficult to ban something that has been an integral part of a culture for centuries. But societal attitudes can change quite quickly. For example, homosexuality has gone from being illegal, to being tolerated and now (I think for a lot of people in the UK) pretty much a non-issue in 50 years.
  - AlecSchueler 3y ago
    I think that's what the person above was saying already, just that it's a surprise that many intelligent people still prioritise tradition over the logical arguments.
- hermitcrab 3y ago
  How much is vaping taking up the slack? Here in the UK it seems that cigarettes have to be hidden from view in a 'drawer of shame' while vapes are in left clear view. I'm not sure why vapes seem to be getting an easier ride than cigarettes. Are vapes any less harmful than cigarettes? Apart from the effects on health they create a lot more waste. Also some vapes seem to be clearly marketed to children. (Disclaimer: I have never smoked or vaped, so it isn't a subject I know much about. Please enlighten me.)

padjo 3y ago

As a former smoker and meat eater I know smoking was far far harder to give up than meat since there is a physical addiction component. Meat eating is just habit and something you can easily enough wean yourself away from.

sigilis 3y ago
It’s on the list of things I want to change about myself. I’m a work in progress. Dietary control is not something I have been able to exercise in the past. I’m attempting to obtain pharmaceutical help on that front, so maybe I will be able to execute on being a better person in that dimension in the coming months.

AlecSchueler 3y ago

Cigarette use is plummeting in the west.

sigilis 3y ago
Meat eating should also plummet if meat eating is banned in restaurants and there’s a minimum meat eating age that increases a year at a time. Bonus if there’s a health insurance question about meat eating and special meat taxes. There is no societal structure to disincentivize meat eating. Social pressure from vegetarians (which is so very slight) and logical arguments are the only thing we’ve got. Tradition, convenience, identity, and preferences are all arrayed against the reasonable thing. For now meat consumption is probably going to be somewhat inversely correlated to meat prices, as per usual.
- padjo 3y ago
  In fairness it has been dropping, eg https://www.bbc.com/news/science-environment-58831636 https://www.bbc.com/news/science-environment-58831636 Here’s hoping a tipping point is reached soon
- Scarblac 3y ago
  I'd expect change to come either from stronger regulation of agriculture that makes it much harder to produce meat, or if that's not introduced, from huge food shortages after desertification and other climate change effects become more pronounced. As long as meat is produced in sufficient quantity and at prices consumers can afford, I don't expect huge change from them.
- hermitcrab 3y ago
  It is difficult to ban something that has been an integral part of a culture for centuries. But societal attitudes can change quite quickly. For example, homosexuality has gone from being illegal, to being tolerated and now (I think for a lot of people in the UK) pretty much a non-issue in 50 years.
- AlecSchueler 3y ago
  I think that's what the person above was saying already, just that it's a surprise that many intelligent people still prioritise tradition over the logical arguments.
hermitcrab 3y ago
How much is vaping taking up the slack? Here in the UK it seems that cigarettes have to be hidden from view in a 'drawer of shame' while vapes are in left clear view. I'm not sure why vapes seem to be getting an easier ride than cigarettes. Are vapes any less harmful than cigarettes? Apart from the effects on health they create a lot more waste. Also some vapes seem to be clearly marketed to children. (Disclaimer: I have never smoked or vaped, so it isn't a subject I know much about. Please enlighten me.)