4 ms·

Choosing to pay through Apple or not should be the consumer's decision, not Apple's. Especially when you're paying extra for it, which is how it is hurting cons

Choosing to pay through Apple or not should be the consumer's decision, not Apple's. Especially when you're paying extra for it, which is how it is hurting consumers. The whole reason Apple removed Epic's Fortnite from the Apple App Store was an additional payment method that didn't use Apple's. I'm sure legitimate developers would be fine using Apple's payment as long as they can pass those additional fees to the customer. YouTube does that now for example with higher rates on iOS. The issue is that apps aren't allowed to advertise that they can get it cheaper elsewhere. That's why some apps like Netflix and Kindle refuse to let you purchase on iOS at all, because it would artificially increases their prices with those additional fees. If Apple have to compete with other payment processors, that's good for consumers too because it'll lower fees.

nerdjon 3y ago
You’re right and we are in agreement. It should be the choice of the consumer. As a consumer I made the choice to use Apple system. But we are kidding ourselves if we think that once the floodgates are open and developers are no longer forced to use Apple’s system that they will. Removing the choice from consumers. Developers will jump at the chance to “forget” to tell me my yearly subscription is about to renew or not give me a one click option to remove subscriptions. Something I get with the App Store. Also I have said it before and will continue to repeat this. Developers think they will get more money by being out of the App Store but there is a lot of subscription I use now that I would never pay for if I couldn’t through the App Store. For myself and many others their choice is to take the 30% (really it’s less considering there are still credit card processing fees and unless you make your own billing system the fees of other systems) or nothing.
- ThatPlayer 3y ago
  >For myself and many others their choice is to take the 30% (really it’s less considering there are still credit card processing fees and unless you make your own billing system the fees of other systems) or nothing. Exactly, in which case they would have to come back to the Apple App Store. Still I'm not sure how common this sentiment is with how popular Netflix and Spotify still are even without App Store payment methods. It's still beneficial for you if Apple have to compete, cuz maybe now they'll lower that 30% fee, and you can have all the advantages of Apple's subscription management and a lower price. The whole reason Apple blocks other payment services is because they know plenty of consumers will choose the cheaper one. Which is what Epic tried to do with allowing multiple payment options in Fortnite that got them removed. That is removing consumer choice.
  - Terretta 3y ago
    > maybe now they'll lower that 30% fee They already do in year 2, and have for a long time. Once you are looking at the recurring cut to compare, I suggest taking a look at the % fee of app stores in general, whether open or closed, with competitors, or no, and the services those stores provide for those fees. Also look at the cost of cobbling together an equivalent quality stack, fully, including the overhead of having to manage that stack and labor to turn the crank. Finally look at what creators get in wide open markets relative to portions that go to warehousing, logistics, distribution, product stocking/placement, sales, payments, and support. Creators are not seeing 70%.
    - ThatPlayer 3y ago
      Yeah, if Apple are already providing the best value, they have nothing to worry about from competitors.
  - musicale 3y ago
    > The whole reason Apple blocks other payment services is because they know plenty of consumers will choose the cheaper one It's almost as if it isn't a payment processing fee at all but a platform fee that enables Apple (or Google) to make money on "free to play" apps with in-app purchases. I can definitely see why a developer like Epic would want to pay platform fees for Fortnite to Apple and Google that are lower than what they currently pay to Sony, Microsoft or Nintendo. https://www.gamesindustry.biz/30-is-a-market-fee-not-a-monopoly-fee-says-google-epic-vs-google https://www.gamesindustry.biz/30-is-a-market-fee-not-a-monop...
musicale 3y ago
Apple will finally be forced to lower its platform fees, maybe to something comparable to what Android developers enjoy on Google Play: https://www.androidauthority.com/google-match-apple-lapp-subscription-fee-15-percent-809047/ https://www.androidauthority.com/google-match-apple-lapp-sub... Personally I don't see any reason why game developers should have to pay the same kind of platform fees for the App Store that they pay for Google Play or the Nintendo eShop.

nerdjon 3y ago

You’re right and we are in agreement. It should be the choice of the consumer. As a consumer I made the choice to use Apple system. But we are kidding ourselves if we think that once the floodgates are open and developers are no longer forced to use Apple’s system that they will. Removing the choice from consumers. Developers will jump at the chance to “forget” to tell me my yearly subscription is about to renew or not give me a one click option to remove subscriptions. Something I get with the App Store. Also I have said it before and will continue to repeat this. Developers think they will get more money by being out of the App Store but there is a lot of subscription I use now that I would never pay for if I couldn’t through the App Store. For myself and many others their choice is to take the 30% (really it’s less considering there are still credit card processing fees and unless you make your own billing system the fees of other systems) or nothing.

ThatPlayer 3y ago
>For myself and many others their choice is to take the 30% (really it’s less considering there are still credit card processing fees and unless you make your own billing system the fees of other systems) or nothing. Exactly, in which case they would have to come back to the Apple App Store. Still I'm not sure how common this sentiment is with how popular Netflix and Spotify still are even without App Store payment methods. It's still beneficial for you if Apple have to compete, cuz maybe now they'll lower that 30% fee, and you can have all the advantages of Apple's subscription management and a lower price. The whole reason Apple blocks other payment services is because they know plenty of consumers will choose the cheaper one. Which is what Epic tried to do with allowing multiple payment options in Fortnite that got them removed. That is removing consumer choice.
- Terretta 3y ago
  > maybe now they'll lower that 30% fee They already do in year 2, and have for a long time. Once you are looking at the recurring cut to compare, I suggest taking a look at the % fee of app stores in general, whether open or closed, with competitors, or no, and the services those stores provide for those fees. Also look at the cost of cobbling together an equivalent quality stack, fully, including the overhead of having to manage that stack and labor to turn the crank. Finally look at what creators get in wide open markets relative to portions that go to warehousing, logistics, distribution, product stocking/placement, sales, payments, and support. Creators are not seeing 70%.
  - ThatPlayer 3y ago
    Yeah, if Apple are already providing the best value, they have nothing to worry about from competitors.
- musicale 3y ago
  > The whole reason Apple blocks other payment services is because they know plenty of consumers will choose the cheaper one It's almost as if it isn't a payment processing fee at all but a platform fee that enables Apple (or Google) to make money on "free to play" apps with in-app purchases. I can definitely see why a developer like Epic would want to pay platform fees for Fortnite to Apple and Google that are lower than what they currently pay to Sony, Microsoft or Nintendo. https://www.gamesindustry.biz/30-is-a-market-fee-not-a-monopoly-fee-says-google-epic-vs-google https://www.gamesindustry.biz/30-is-a-market-fee-not-a-monop...

musicale 3y ago

Apple will finally be forced to lower its platform fees, maybe to something comparable to what Android developers enjoy on Google Play: https://www.androidauthority.com/google-match-apple-lapp-subscription-fee-15-percent-809047/ https://www.androidauthority.com/google-match-apple-lapp-sub... Personally I don't see any reason why game developers should have to pay the same kind of platform fees for the App Store that they pay for Google Play or the Nintendo eShop.