4 ms·

Any professional program instills way more than just knowledge to pass a test. The fact that you survived long enough to pass the test is often a big part of th

Any professional program instills way more than just knowledge to pass a test. The fact that you survived long enough to pass the test is often a big part of the test's function. The graded practice thing is actually even more intimidating. Not only do you have to do well, you have to do well live in front of people, and you have to have had the requisite experience in those hours of practice to get an adequate portfolio together. This portfolio development component can be brutally harder than all the tests combined.

ibejoeb 3y ago
If you've practiced for a decade in one state, and then you moved to another state without reciprocity (many permutations) and want to work, suddenly you have to sit again. That's a very different headspace. This "supervised work" is a good option in this scenario.
- kstrauser 3y ago
  That's the same for doctors. My wife and I moved to a state without reciprocity. One of the local requirements was to have passed the board qualification exams -- the ones you take as a med school senior as part of applying to residencies -- within the last 10 years. Doesn't matter if you've been practicing for 25 years, or even teaching in a med school: you're taking the test again. My wife's the genius of our family and passed it the first time through. I'm glad I work in an industry where I don't have to ever take and pass my college exams again.
throwitaway222 3y ago
Then test EVERYTHING one should know
- killjoywashere 3y ago
  How do you propose testing real world ethics in a controlled environment?
  - JamesBarney 3y ago
    Ethics is two parts. What is the expected ethical decision to make for a lawyer, and actually following through with the ethical behavior. A test can easily test the former, and schooling doesn't do anything to test the latter.
lucb1e 3y ago
> Any professional program instills way more than just knowledge to pass a test. If you talk to someone for thirty minutes about the same subfield as you do, you can definitely tell whether they know it. Mass testing on paper is harder because of cheating (even if only a small minority does it, it defeats the purpose). It's orders of magnitude cheaper to have a good test, one-on-one if need be, as compared to hiring all the teachers necessary to give everyone a standardized education. I've learned very little in my master's. Call me the problem for already knowing most concepts and just having to learn-by-heart some protocol byte offsets (yes, that was actually asked on a closed-book test), but a year of memorization of some specific things is and getting a certificate for that is far less valuable/actionable than making sure someone can do the actual job and giving a certificate for that. Yet the former certificate is what most companies base starting pay grade on, or for being considered at all, no matter what they claim before you get to HR. (Edited the number in first response line from hyperbole to actual estimate. Also loving that people are downvoting reality they, I guess, don't like? Or what's the problem?)

ibejoeb 3y ago

If you've practiced for a decade in one state, and then you moved to another state without reciprocity (many permutations) and want to work, suddenly you have to sit again. That's a very different headspace. This "supervised work" is a good option in this scenario.

kstrauser 3y ago
That's the same for doctors. My wife and I moved to a state without reciprocity. One of the local requirements was to have passed the board qualification exams -- the ones you take as a med school senior as part of applying to residencies -- within the last 10 years. Doesn't matter if you've been practicing for 25 years, or even teaching in a med school: you're taking the test again. My wife's the genius of our family and passed it the first time through. I'm glad I work in an industry where I don't have to ever take and pass my college exams again.

throwitaway222 3y ago

Then test EVERYTHING one should know

killjoywashere 3y ago
How do you propose testing real world ethics in a controlled environment?
- JamesBarney 3y ago
  Ethics is two parts. What is the expected ethical decision to make for a lawyer, and actually following through with the ethical behavior. A test can easily test the former, and schooling doesn't do anything to test the latter.

lucb1e 3y ago

> Any professional program instills way more than just knowledge to pass a test. If you talk to someone for thirty minutes about the same subfield as you do, you can definitely tell whether they know it. Mass testing on paper is harder because of cheating (even if only a small minority does it, it defeats the purpose). It's orders of magnitude cheaper to have a good test, one-on-one if need be, as compared to hiring all the teachers necessary to give everyone a standardized education. I've learned very little in my master's. Call me the problem for already knowing most concepts and just having to learn-by-heart some protocol byte offsets (yes, that was actually asked on a closed-book test), but a year of memorization of some specific things is and getting a certificate for that is far less valuable/actionable than making sure someone can do the actual job and giving a certificate for that. Yet the former certificate is what most companies base starting pay grade on, or for being considered at all, no matter what they claim before you get to HR. (Edited the number in first response line from hyperbole to actual estimate. Also loving that people are downvoting reality they, I guess, don't like? Or what's the problem?)