5 ms·

I don't think Apple is the pinnacle of repairability by any means, but they have been making slow improvements in this area (like replaceable back glass in the

I don't think Apple is the pinnacle of repairability by any means, but they have been making slow improvements in this area (like replaceable back glass in the new model phones, the entire mainboard doesn't need to be replaced for common repairs as often now, etc).

jokethrowaway 3y ago
I don't know on which planet you live but every new generation is worse than the previous one. My last macbook needed to have a battery replaced during Apple Care (after only 2 years) and they just gave me a new body (no dents, same specs, same keyboard layout, transplanted the ssd - or transferred the data, not sure) and plugged it to the old screen. If they don't bother swapping a battery...
- wtallis 3y ago
  Citing something that's been the same way for all Apple laptops for at least a decade doesn't really support your assertion that it gets worse with every generation. Your repair was probably done by moving your laptop's motherboard into a new lower case (with a corresponding new battery glued in).
  - bluescrn 3y ago
    Is there any real justification for glueing batteries in beyond obstructing replacement? It's not as if there's any space for them to slide around, they're a fairly tight fit in a compact device, and there's got to be plenty of other options to keep them in place if there is a little bit of looseness to deal with. (I guess they'll use safety as an excuse, to reduce the risk of the damage to cells. But it's not the real reason, is it?)
    - giantrobot 3y ago
      The case isn't so tight the batteries can't move. LiPoly batteries expand and contract when they heat and cool. The case needs enough space for that to happen without putting pressure on the battery. When the battery is at its most contracted state it can move if it's not fixed to the case by some means. Movement of the battery puts stress on the connectors and can lead to a short (or worse). Gluing the battery in the case is a safe way of fixing it in place inside the case. Screw tabs would give the opportunity during assembly of puncturing the battery casing with a tool or screw. They could also work themselves loose with the thermal expansion cycles. But people like the thought-terminating "Apple bad" narratives.
      - bluescrn 3y ago
        Surely there's a non-adhesive material that'd serve that purpose though, some sort of foam or rubber perhaps?
        wtallis 3y ago
        I think adhesive and screws are the only two practical options for securing a battery well enough to prevent repeated cable flexing, which is probably much more of a concern than screws coming loose.
        kilburn 3y ago
        Are you saying these were some sort of hazardous devices ready to explode at the most inexpected time? [1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=62wUaJUh4Ko https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=62wUaJUh4Ko
        wtallis 3y ago
        Those batteries are glued in to their own rigid case, which makes swapping them out of the laptop trivial but also didn't leave much room for expansion inside the battery pack, and the battery pack was pretty thick compared to any recent Apple laptop. Replacing the cells inside one of those packs would have been similarly difficult to ungluing and replacing the batteries in more recent Apple laptops, but there was a lot less reason to rebuild those battery packs.
      - pineaux 3y ago
        Nah, this is just an apologetic just look at the amount of engineering they put in their Thunderbolt 4 cables: https://www.lumafield.com/article/usb-c-cable-charger-head-to-head-comparison-apple-thunderbolt-amazon-basics https://www.lumafield.com/article/usb-c-cable-charger-head-t... Its crazy stuff. You are telling me they cant think of a secure way to use a mechanical, screwed system that is able to cope with the thermal expansion. I find that hard to believe. I believe it is mostly cost and profit incentive, MAYBE safety, but I also doubt that last one.
- jjjjmoney 3y ago
  [dead]
tmpz22 3y ago
Apple has a billion dollar PR engine trying to convince you that privacy was Apple's idea or repairability was their idea. It wasn't. Its them trying to get in front of regulation in the EU and outmaneuver their competitors. Do you think the iphone 15 being USB-C was Apple's idea too?
- jjjjmoney 3y ago
  [dead]
cfr2023 3y ago
I think Apple essentially sells disposable, glued shut, one time use electronics while grandstanding like crazy about the environment. Lisa Jackson has probably the hardest job at the whole company, to drum up the stats and relativism to make it look like they are trying at all in any meaningful way, and not just lying about their portfolio of dystopian horrors and banal inconveniences.
- riversflow 3y ago
  My house is full Apple products, the average device is well over 5 years old. The gaming PC I built after the MBP I use is virtually worthless now, as the motherboard is fried and buying a new socket LGA 1150 motherboard just isn't worth it. All electronics are the result of dystopian horors, and they generally don't have a very good shelf life. Are you aware of how many SuperFund sites are in Silicon Valley?
  - cfr2023 3y ago
    Pretty dull newsflash, this is the exact kind of weak, destructive relativism I was talking about in my post. Apple's the worst, except for all the rest? I should lay off Apple because they're doing better than their competitors? You're not opening any eyes by saying everyone is doing terribly, you're just responding to dissent with tired whataboutism and false claims of futility. The market and regulators and device builders and customers could do better and should. Apple wants to claim be leader in this space, they should do so with substance.
    - riversflow 3y ago
      My substance was that my Apple products consistently out live every other electronic manufacturer's. I have an iMac and a MBP that are both over a decade old now and run great. The hardware is excellent after putting a new battery in the MBP and an SSD in the iMac. Especially the 2013 MBP with Retina display, its still an awesome machine even at 10 years old. The biggest problems with old iPhones are banking Apps and cellular connectivity. Until we find a way of mineral extraction and purification that isn't terrible, electronics are going to be bad. Could Apple work to improve that? Yes, and they should too. My point, which I'd argue is pragmatic, is that Apple makes the longest lived devices you can currently buy, and not by a little but by a lot. Demonizing the current front runner in a competition you care about? ...well lets just say you attract more flies with honey than with vinegar
throitallaway 3y ago
Woz himself has spoken out against Apple's anti-repair stance. For a few gens now "simple" to swap out iPhone parts like screens need to be purchased directly from Apple and authorized to go into the device that's being repaired via IMEI. This kills off tons of third party market options. Imagine if vehicle manufacturers required that you buy all replacement parts from them. In the case of vehicles, there are tons of used, reconditioned, and third party parts available that work just fine as replacements. This kind of behavior is why I'll never "buy" an Apple device; you never truly own it and can do what you want to do with it, from both hardware and software perspectives. https://screenrant.com/apple-self-service-program-requires-serial-number/ https://screenrant.com/apple-self-service-program-requires-s...

jokethrowaway 3y ago

I don't know on which planet you live but every new generation is worse than the previous one. My last macbook needed to have a battery replaced during Apple Care (after only 2 years) and they just gave me a new body (no dents, same specs, same keyboard layout, transplanted the ssd - or transferred the data, not sure) and plugged it to the old screen. If they don't bother swapping a battery...

wtallis 3y ago
Citing something that's been the same way for all Apple laptops for at least a decade doesn't really support your assertion that it gets worse with every generation. Your repair was probably done by moving your laptop's motherboard into a new lower case (with a corresponding new battery glued in).
- bluescrn 3y ago
  Is there any real justification for glueing batteries in beyond obstructing replacement? It's not as if there's any space for them to slide around, they're a fairly tight fit in a compact device, and there's got to be plenty of other options to keep them in place if there is a little bit of looseness to deal with. (I guess they'll use safety as an excuse, to reduce the risk of the damage to cells. But it's not the real reason, is it?)
  - giantrobot 3y ago
    The case isn't so tight the batteries can't move. LiPoly batteries expand and contract when they heat and cool. The case needs enough space for that to happen without putting pressure on the battery. When the battery is at its most contracted state it can move if it's not fixed to the case by some means. Movement of the battery puts stress on the connectors and can lead to a short (or worse). Gluing the battery in the case is a safe way of fixing it in place inside the case. Screw tabs would give the opportunity during assembly of puncturing the battery casing with a tool or screw. They could also work themselves loose with the thermal expansion cycles. But people like the thought-terminating "Apple bad" narratives.
    - bluescrn 3y ago
      Surely there's a non-adhesive material that'd serve that purpose though, some sort of foam or rubber perhaps?
      - wtallis 3y ago
        I think adhesive and screws are the only two practical options for securing a battery well enough to prevent repeated cable flexing, which is probably much more of a concern than screws coming loose.
        kilburn 3y ago
        Are you saying these were some sort of hazardous devices ready to explode at the most inexpected time? [1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=62wUaJUh4Ko https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=62wUaJUh4Ko
        wtallis 3y ago
        Those batteries are glued in to their own rigid case, which makes swapping them out of the laptop trivial but also didn't leave much room for expansion inside the battery pack, and the battery pack was pretty thick compared to any recent Apple laptop. Replacing the cells inside one of those packs would have been similarly difficult to ungluing and replacing the batteries in more recent Apple laptops, but there was a lot less reason to rebuild those battery packs.
    - pineaux 3y ago
      Nah, this is just an apologetic just look at the amount of engineering they put in their Thunderbolt 4 cables: https://www.lumafield.com/article/usb-c-cable-charger-head-to-head-comparison-apple-thunderbolt-amazon-basics https://www.lumafield.com/article/usb-c-cable-charger-head-t... Its crazy stuff. You are telling me they cant think of a secure way to use a mechanical, screwed system that is able to cope with the thermal expansion. I find that hard to believe. I believe it is mostly cost and profit incentive, MAYBE safety, but I also doubt that last one.
jjjjmoney 3y ago
[dead]

tmpz22 3y ago

Apple has a billion dollar PR engine trying to convince you that privacy was Apple's idea or repairability was their idea. It wasn't. Its them trying to get in front of regulation in the EU and outmaneuver their competitors. Do you think the iphone 15 being USB-C was Apple's idea too?

jjjjmoney 3y ago
[dead]

cfr2023 3y ago

I think Apple essentially sells disposable, glued shut, one time use electronics while grandstanding like crazy about the environment. Lisa Jackson has probably the hardest job at the whole company, to drum up the stats and relativism to make it look like they are trying at all in any meaningful way, and not just lying about their portfolio of dystopian horrors and banal inconveniences.

riversflow 3y ago
My house is full Apple products, the average device is well over 5 years old. The gaming PC I built after the MBP I use is virtually worthless now, as the motherboard is fried and buying a new socket LGA 1150 motherboard just isn't worth it. All electronics are the result of dystopian horors, and they generally don't have a very good shelf life. Are you aware of how many SuperFund sites are in Silicon Valley?
- cfr2023 3y ago
  Pretty dull newsflash, this is the exact kind of weak, destructive relativism I was talking about in my post. Apple's the worst, except for all the rest? I should lay off Apple because they're doing better than their competitors? You're not opening any eyes by saying everyone is doing terribly, you're just responding to dissent with tired whataboutism and false claims of futility. The market and regulators and device builders and customers could do better and should. Apple wants to claim be leader in this space, they should do so with substance.
  - riversflow 3y ago
    My substance was that my Apple products consistently out live every other electronic manufacturer's. I have an iMac and a MBP that are both over a decade old now and run great. The hardware is excellent after putting a new battery in the MBP and an SSD in the iMac. Especially the 2013 MBP with Retina display, its still an awesome machine even at 10 years old. The biggest problems with old iPhones are banking Apps and cellular connectivity. Until we find a way of mineral extraction and purification that isn't terrible, electronics are going to be bad. Could Apple work to improve that? Yes, and they should too. My point, which I'd argue is pragmatic, is that Apple makes the longest lived devices you can currently buy, and not by a little but by a lot. Demonizing the current front runner in a competition you care about? ...well lets just say you attract more flies with honey than with vinegar

throitallaway 3y ago

Woz himself has spoken out against Apple's anti-repair stance. For a few gens now "simple" to swap out iPhone parts like screens need to be purchased directly from Apple and authorized to go into the device that's being repaired via IMEI. This kills off tons of third party market options. Imagine if vehicle manufacturers required that you buy all replacement parts from them. In the case of vehicles, there are tons of used, reconditioned, and third party parts available that work just fine as replacements. This kind of behavior is why I'll never "buy" an Apple device; you never truly own it and can do what you want to do with it, from both hardware and software perspectives. https://screenrant.com/apple-self-service-program-requires-serial-number/ https://screenrant.com/apple-self-service-program-requires-s...