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I do have some slightly concerns about iMessage being opened up and no longer linked to Apple products for a spam standpoint. But I get plenty of SMS spam so I

I do have some slightly concerns about iMessage being opened up and no longer linked to Apple products for a spam standpoint. But I get plenty of SMS spam so I guess it's really not much of a difference. However kinda related I am curious about RCS. I tried looking this up but I can't find much concrete information on it. Is it actually universally E2E or only some? I find some reddit posts implying it's some. Do all RCS messages go through Google's servers? Or some other central servers that are not the involved carriers.

kelnos 3y ago
> Is it actually universally E2E or only some? I find some reddit posts implying it's some. The E2EE on RCS is an extension to the protocol developed by Google. I don't know who has implemented it other than Google. So if a user is on a carrier that does their own RCS impl (many carriers piggyback off of Google's so they don't have to deal with it), they may not have E2EE. > Do all RCS messages go through Google's servers? If your carrier isn't using Google's implementation, and you're messaging someone on a carrier also not using Google's implementation, then it won't go through Google's servers. Otherwise, it will. In theory, this won't matter, assuming the E2EE is implemented correctly and securely. I don't know if an audit has been done, though. There's also the case where one person is on a carrier using Google's impl, and the other is on a carrier that is not, and that carrier has not implemented E2EE. Then the message will go through Google's servers, and Google will be able to read it. This is how I understand it, anyway; I don't intimately know the details of the protocol, so this might not be 100% correct.
- nerdjon 3y ago
  Interesting, assuming this is all correct (I tried to look around and the information on this seems to be purposefully vague from a marketing standpoint for RCS.). I am perfectly fine with Apple not rushing to implement RCS. It may be a business decision for their part but any chance that the messages information will go through Google's servers is a full no go for me and is not a valid alternative in my opinion. Even if it is encrypted (which seems to not be guaranteed anyways), it still gives Google data I don't care for them to have.
  - pests 3y ago
    If you don't use iPhone and Apple implements RCS then it is your decision to send data to Google by your choice of which phone you choose. If you do use iPhone then you could selectively choose not to RCS texts contacts that you know use a Google RCS implementation.
    - nerdjon 3y ago
      That doesn't seem to be the case based on how I am understanding what was said? If RCS goes through my carrier it is up to my carrier if it's Google's implementation or not? Meaning Google's servers or not? If the person I am talking too is on an Android phone I would also assume the same, that the text is likely going through Google's servers at some point. Needing to know whether or not a specific contact is using Google's RCS implementation seems like quite the hassle when "Google" is the flaw for RCS in my opinion. If I am misunderstanding, I would love to be corrected.
      - pests 3y ago
        Oops. I had a brain fart and was linking RCS to phone model not to service provider. You should be correct afaik.
remotefonts 3y ago
Do cell phone network carriers even have any part on RCS messages? If I have no wifi and no mobile data but still have minutes and sms's no RCS message will ever leave my device, so I would say all of them will go though google servers, because if they can't reach google servers they will not even leave your phone to go anywhere. Such a beautiful mess. What's not to love about it?
- dagmx 3y ago
  It depends if you’re using Google’s RCS or not. Different carriers also support RCS via their servers. What you have access to depends on your device and carrier.
dagmx 3y ago
It is implementation dependent. Google’s version is E2E (for single chats at least, not sure for multiple) but others may not be.

kelnos 3y ago

> Is it actually universally E2E or only some? I find some reddit posts implying it's some. The E2EE on RCS is an extension to the protocol developed by Google. I don't know who has implemented it other than Google. So if a user is on a carrier that does their own RCS impl (many carriers piggyback off of Google's so they don't have to deal with it), they may not have E2EE. > Do all RCS messages go through Google's servers? If your carrier isn't using Google's implementation, and you're messaging someone on a carrier also not using Google's implementation, then it won't go through Google's servers. Otherwise, it will. In theory, this won't matter, assuming the E2EE is implemented correctly and securely. I don't know if an audit has been done, though. There's also the case where one person is on a carrier using Google's impl, and the other is on a carrier that is not, and that carrier has not implemented E2EE. Then the message will go through Google's servers, and Google will be able to read it. This is how I understand it, anyway; I don't intimately know the details of the protocol, so this might not be 100% correct.

nerdjon 3y ago
Interesting, assuming this is all correct (I tried to look around and the information on this seems to be purposefully vague from a marketing standpoint for RCS.). I am perfectly fine with Apple not rushing to implement RCS. It may be a business decision for their part but any chance that the messages information will go through Google's servers is a full no go for me and is not a valid alternative in my opinion. Even if it is encrypted (which seems to not be guaranteed anyways), it still gives Google data I don't care for them to have.
- pests 3y ago
  If you don't use iPhone and Apple implements RCS then it is your decision to send data to Google by your choice of which phone you choose. If you do use iPhone then you could selectively choose not to RCS texts contacts that you know use a Google RCS implementation.
  - nerdjon 3y ago
    That doesn't seem to be the case based on how I am understanding what was said? If RCS goes through my carrier it is up to my carrier if it's Google's implementation or not? Meaning Google's servers or not? If the person I am talking too is on an Android phone I would also assume the same, that the text is likely going through Google's servers at some point. Needing to know whether or not a specific contact is using Google's RCS implementation seems like quite the hassle when "Google" is the flaw for RCS in my opinion. If I am misunderstanding, I would love to be corrected.
    - pests 3y ago
      Oops. I had a brain fart and was linking RCS to phone model not to service provider. You should be correct afaik.

remotefonts 3y ago

Do cell phone network carriers even have any part on RCS messages? If I have no wifi and no mobile data but still have minutes and sms's no RCS message will ever leave my device, so I would say all of them will go though google servers, because if they can't reach google servers they will not even leave your phone to go anywhere. Such a beautiful mess. What's not to love about it?

dagmx 3y ago
It depends if you’re using Google’s RCS or not. Different carriers also support RCS via their servers. What you have access to depends on your device and carrier.

dagmx 3y ago

It is implementation dependent. Google’s version is E2E (for single chats at least, not sure for multiple) but others may not be.