6 ms·

I really don't get what is it that people like so much about iMessage that they use it instead of WhatsApp or even Telegram or Signal. I really don't get it. C

I really don't get what is it that people like so much about iMessage that they use it instead of WhatsApp or even Telegram or Signal. I really don't get it. Can anyone explain what is it that is so good that you end up using a solution that 40% in the USA and 60% in the rest of the world cannot use?

nerdjon 3y ago
In the US we used text messages for years so just sticking with that makes sense. I guess most of us just never really saw a reason to move to anything else. Why would I when I have been communicating with everyone through my phone number for 15ish years? I have honestly been curious why the rest of the world doesn't do this? Was SMS not used as much?
- mattmanser 3y ago
  You were actually late to text messages, not early. The US still had huge pager numbers when consumers in the EU was all in on text messages. For example this article discusses low SMS usage in the US from 2000: https://www.nytimes.com/2000/12/07/technology/us-is-lagging-behind-europe-in-short-messaging-services.html https://www.nytimes.com/2000/12/07/technology/us-is-lagging-... Just like you were late to dropping cheques vs chip and pin, the US has been a laggard in consumer adoption of some technologies. Might be something to do with the relative power of your state governments vs federal meaning your infrastructure is sometimes less co-ordinated, as a guess.
  - nerdjon 3y ago
    I can't read the article but going on what you said... that's interesting. Then I really don't understand why did the EU just not stick with SMS (and iMessage). Like what was the value of going with a new app. I was just using this same number with SMS on dumb phones... why would I switch?
    - marcod 3y ago
      SMS were expensive in Europe.
      - nerdjon 3y ago
        Interesting, did you not have unlimited texting? I feel like unlimited texting was standard here since 2007 at least.
        paddez 3y ago
        If my memory recalls correct, in Ireland, Pay-as-you-go was relatively popular for a number of different demographics. Most networks implemented some kind of Top up €20, get 200 free minutes, 200 free texts, unlimited same-network texts, and X GB of data for the month. WhatsApp came in, which meant that that all networks could now talk to each other using the Data allowance for free, essentially - which I think convinced people to use WhatsApp rather than dwindle down their network text quota.
    - koyote 3y ago
      > I was just using this same number with SMS on dumb phones... why would I switch? We did use SMS extensively in the early 2000s. But many people also used things like Google Talk (and MSN Messenger on the PC) early on as it allowed you to send more than just text. MMS never really took off because not all phones supported it the same way and a lot of carriers charged for it (it also felt clunky). Once you get used to one app, it's easy to move to another one. WhatsApp quickly took off as it was very easy to set up (install, enter phone number, you're done), worked on literally any phone OS and was simple to use. It's a bit like wondering why everyone is using Slack when there's E-mail. iMessage was a non-starter because the iphone was just not that popular here (and still isn't what the majority use in most countries), so using an app that only works with a phone that less than half of your friends use made no sense.
    - kwanbix 3y ago
      Because SMS sucks big time: limited characters, cannot send videos, cannot send images, cannot do groups, it was charged by message, the interface really sucked. So the question is, why won't you switch? In my home country, lots of people just had a BlackBerry because they wanted to do better chat. Then WhatsApp came, which did not require a BlackBerry worked in all types of phones (Android and iOS included), it used your same phone number, it did not charge by message, could do images, videos, groups, the interface was great, and it spread like fire.
  - kelnos 3y ago
    That doesn't really make sense to me. If we were lagging in SMS usage, it was almost certainly because of one or two factors (I can't read the article you linked, so not sure if this is in there): 1. SMSes were fairly expensive, and we had to pay per-message both to send and receive them. 2. Most people I knew (I was in college at the time) didn't even have cell phones (due to cost?). My dad even worked for Verizon, and he and my mom got them fairly late. I remember going on a trip to NYC in the summer of 2000, and my mom lent me her cell phone for emergencies. I didn't get my own cell phone until 2002. I don't think I knew anyone with a pager at that point. My dad used to carry one for on-call notifications for his job in the 80s & 90s, but by 2000 he had the cell phone. The joke in my circles at that point was that pagers were for drug dealers. I know there was still heavy (non-drug-dealer) pager use in the US back then, though.
- mcfedr 3y ago
  It was, but was long charged per message, so things like WhatsApp were quickly appealing, also for group chat, that SMS never did
  - kelnos 3y ago
    The interesting thing is that this was the case in the US as well (and, even worse: we continued with our strange custom of charging both for sending and receiving a message). I don't recall when carriers here started rolling out unlimited texting plans at prices that made it a no-brainer for most people. Maybe that was earlier here than elsewhere, which drove people elsewhere to find alternatives, but made it not a big deal to stick with SMS here. (I dated someone for a while who had this very old grandfathered phone plan that she liked, which didn't include unlimited SMS. This was in 2016-2018; at the time she was the only person I used Whatsapp to text with.)
- andyferris 3y ago
  It was cost. In many countries SMS was still so-and-so cents per message long after it was both free in the US and WhatsApp was born.
matt123456789 3y ago
You answered your question with your last sentence.
plumeria 3y ago
It is wild to me that someone prefers to use a medium that is not end-to-end encrypted.
- changoplatanero 3y ago
  I think you would find that most iphone users don't even know what end-to-end encryption is.
- marcod 3y ago
  I'm gonna try and channel the average user's priorities when selecting their messaging app: 1. Are the people I chat with on there? 2. Is it free? 3. Do I have to install something? 4. Is it easy to use/sign up? 5. Does it have the bells and whistles I want? .. X. What does end to end encryption mean?
andyferris 3y ago
I think built-in to your phone is part of it. It’s also very simple and replaces SMS automagically. Otherwise you need to sign up and log in to some other service. Meaning everyone you talk to needs to do the same. With the SMS fallback this doesn’t “feel” like that.
- kwanbix 3y ago
  Thanks, I see your point, but registering an account with WhatsApp is one of the easiest things to do, you just give your phone number, and you get an SMS that WhatsApp even reads itself (at least on android), and that's it. On the other side, with iMessage, there is a huge chance somebody does not have it, and worst, cannot have it because they don't have an iPhone. Again, 40% of the people in the USA owns an Android phone. Is a lot.
  - jwestbury 3y ago
    Sure - but I can use iMessage on my phone to text those people anyway. WhatsApp has basically zero market penetration in North America, unlike Europe, so there's no network effect to speak of.
    - kwanbix 3y ago
      But you can message me, but you cannot have a group with me, you cannot send me pictures or videos with good quality, etc. I lived in the US for 1.5 years between 2010 and 2009, and we all used WhatsApp. I never heard or used iMessage.
nickthegreek 3y ago
WhatsApp is owned by Facebook. Signal is a SUPER pain in the ass, and you need a phone number. I dont know a single person who uses Telegram where I live.
garciasn 3y ago
I've never used WhatsApp, Telegram, or Signal but I have used iMessage/SMS. I really don't consider iMessage anything separate from being able to send SMSs; I just know that sometimes my messages are green and most are blue. I'd be surprised if iMessage users think as much about this as much as Android users and/or Google execs do.
- deadmutex 3y ago
  > I'd be surprised if iMessage users think as much about this as much as Android users and/or Google execs do. I am guessing you're not a teenager in highschool.
  - nickthegreek 3y ago
    83% of teenagers in high school had iPhone in 2019. Android was 9%. So even in high school, at this point, it’s an extreme minority problem. The green bubble war is over and Apple won the youth.
kstrauser 3y ago
It’s there and it takes zero setup. I’ve never seen anything in the alternatives other than that appeals to me. With Messages.app, I can communicate with 100% of my contacts without switching apps. The question isn’t why I haven’t moved to something else, but why I would ever want to.
SirMaster 3y ago
Because if I put someone's phone number into my Messages app, 100% of people will receive my messages with no issue. To decide to use WhatsApp or Signal or Telegram etc I would have to find out if they even have that service/app set up or not. And they have to have the app installed and signed in etc. With iMessage/SMS there is no setup, no sign-in, no approval process or anything.
- justsomehnguy 3y ago
  Take Apple fanboying out of your mind. This is exactly how it happens, you just add someone's phone number to your address book and... and it works? All those services rely on the phone numbers to discover if you can message to the other party. You literally see if the addressee can be called/sent message through WhatsApp. Sure, it's not in your Messages app, but that's because Apple doesn't allow you to see any messaging platforms there except theirs?
  - timeon 3y ago
    How it is Apple fanboying? As far as I know, every phone already has SMS by default. On iPhone some messages goes throug by iMessage - but if other side has no iMessage it is sent as SMS. I do not need to ask them to download/register on iMessages. Everyone with WhatsApp is asking me to download the app.
    - justsomehnguy 3y ago
      > Everyone with WhatsApp is asking me to download the app ... do you understand what iMessage is just another app, the only difference is what it's shipped with every iPhone and that's why it works? Apple has replaced a universal protocol, SMS, with their own app which is not available anywhere except iOS. And you are happy and try to convince everyone what this is totally fine. You are okay for people to buy an iPhone yet you are totally opposed to download a free app. Exactly what Apple wants. >> With iMessage/SMS there is no setup, no sign-in, no approval process or anything. There is a setup - buying an iOS device, there is a sign-in - creating and logging into iCloud or whatever it's called account, there is an approval process - when you create the account you give Apple all what's in the EULA and it's a lot. Oh, and if Google would replace, ahem, enhance SMS with their own proprietary app you would be the first to cry.
kelnos 3y ago
Mainly just defaults. In the US, SMS was always pretty dominant. We didn't gravitate to a single third-party platform like Whatsapp or FB Messenger or Telegram like a lot of people in other countries did. So in practice we all have lots of messaging apps installed on our phones, and SMS is still widely used. Messages is installed by default on iPhones, so people who are used to using SMS (most people) just use iMessage, and if they're communicating with someone without an iPhone, the app just degrades back to SMS.
- intothemild 3y ago
  What I would ultimately want from all this is that SMS goes away. That we get something better, I know there's that new protocol the IEEE have been working on, and there's RCS. I don't care which, or anything else is used, as long as it's platform independent, secure, seamless, and enables all the features of modern messaging platforms. Wife has an iPhone I have an android. One of the big problems with that downgrade is it's really one sided. An example. If I send her a photo, or video, google will send a link to it instead, unique to that message.. so she will see the full sized video or photo. If she sends me a photo or video, it uses MMS... And it's potato quality. I would settle to have apple solve that problem. Because it's solely on apple's side to solve that. But I would ultimately like there to be a successor to SMS/MMS... And soon.
  - kwanbix 3y ago
    > I don't care which, or anything else is used, as long as it's platform independent, secure, seamless, and enables all the features of modern messaging platforms. You are describing WhatsApp (or telegram or signal) or am I missing something?
    - intothemild 3y ago
      I'm describing the replacement for SMS. Whatever the fallback is.
0cf8612b2e1e 3y ago
I don’t want to install Facebook anything onto my device? A company that has repeatedly engineered techniques to escape the app sandbox to exfiltrate personal data is not my friend.
ghusto 3y ago
I’ve always been curious about this too, and the answers here are not exactly enlightening. They seem to boil down to either SMS being cheaper in the U.S.A. and the lack of unlimited texting in Europe (not true), or “because I use it”. I like Messages, I think it’s great, but that doesn’t explain what happened here.
averageRoyalty 3y ago
Because most people I speak to in my non-US country don't have Signal, Telegram or WhatsApp. Or they have one of the three and I need to work out which one. Default messaging app is simpler - if they have iMessage it goes there, if not it's SMS. I can be confident of delivery, and it's no hassle.

nerdjon 3y ago

In the US we used text messages for years so just sticking with that makes sense. I guess most of us just never really saw a reason to move to anything else. Why would I when I have been communicating with everyone through my phone number for 15ish years? I have honestly been curious why the rest of the world doesn't do this? Was SMS not used as much?

mattmanser 3y ago
You were actually late to text messages, not early. The US still had huge pager numbers when consumers in the EU was all in on text messages. For example this article discusses low SMS usage in the US from 2000: https://www.nytimes.com/2000/12/07/technology/us-is-lagging-behind-europe-in-short-messaging-services.html https://www.nytimes.com/2000/12/07/technology/us-is-lagging-... Just like you were late to dropping cheques vs chip and pin, the US has been a laggard in consumer adoption of some technologies. Might be something to do with the relative power of your state governments vs federal meaning your infrastructure is sometimes less co-ordinated, as a guess.
- nerdjon 3y ago
  I can't read the article but going on what you said... that's interesting. Then I really don't understand why did the EU just not stick with SMS (and iMessage). Like what was the value of going with a new app. I was just using this same number with SMS on dumb phones... why would I switch?
  - marcod 3y ago
    SMS were expensive in Europe.
    - nerdjon 3y ago
      Interesting, did you not have unlimited texting? I feel like unlimited texting was standard here since 2007 at least.
      - paddez 3y ago
        If my memory recalls correct, in Ireland, Pay-as-you-go was relatively popular for a number of different demographics. Most networks implemented some kind of Top up €20, get 200 free minutes, 200 free texts, unlimited same-network texts, and X GB of data for the month. WhatsApp came in, which meant that that all networks could now talk to each other using the Data allowance for free, essentially - which I think convinced people to use WhatsApp rather than dwindle down their network text quota.
  - koyote 3y ago
    > I was just using this same number with SMS on dumb phones... why would I switch? We did use SMS extensively in the early 2000s. But many people also used things like Google Talk (and MSN Messenger on the PC) early on as it allowed you to send more than just text. MMS never really took off because not all phones supported it the same way and a lot of carriers charged for it (it also felt clunky). Once you get used to one app, it's easy to move to another one. WhatsApp quickly took off as it was very easy to set up (install, enter phone number, you're done), worked on literally any phone OS and was simple to use. It's a bit like wondering why everyone is using Slack when there's E-mail. iMessage was a non-starter because the iphone was just not that popular here (and still isn't what the majority use in most countries), so using an app that only works with a phone that less than half of your friends use made no sense.
  - kwanbix 3y ago
    Because SMS sucks big time: limited characters, cannot send videos, cannot send images, cannot do groups, it was charged by message, the interface really sucked. So the question is, why won't you switch? In my home country, lots of people just had a BlackBerry because they wanted to do better chat. Then WhatsApp came, which did not require a BlackBerry worked in all types of phones (Android and iOS included), it used your same phone number, it did not charge by message, could do images, videos, groups, the interface was great, and it spread like fire.
- kelnos 3y ago
  That doesn't really make sense to me. If we were lagging in SMS usage, it was almost certainly because of one or two factors (I can't read the article you linked, so not sure if this is in there): 1. SMSes were fairly expensive, and we had to pay per-message both to send and receive them. 2. Most people I knew (I was in college at the time) didn't even have cell phones (due to cost?). My dad even worked for Verizon, and he and my mom got them fairly late. I remember going on a trip to NYC in the summer of 2000, and my mom lent me her cell phone for emergencies. I didn't get my own cell phone until 2002. I don't think I knew anyone with a pager at that point. My dad used to carry one for on-call notifications for his job in the 80s & 90s, but by 2000 he had the cell phone. The joke in my circles at that point was that pagers were for drug dealers. I know there was still heavy (non-drug-dealer) pager use in the US back then, though.
mcfedr 3y ago
It was, but was long charged per message, so things like WhatsApp were quickly appealing, also for group chat, that SMS never did
- kelnos 3y ago
  The interesting thing is that this was the case in the US as well (and, even worse: we continued with our strange custom of charging both for sending and receiving a message). I don't recall when carriers here started rolling out unlimited texting plans at prices that made it a no-brainer for most people. Maybe that was earlier here than elsewhere, which drove people elsewhere to find alternatives, but made it not a big deal to stick with SMS here. (I dated someone for a while who had this very old grandfathered phone plan that she liked, which didn't include unlimited SMS. This was in 2016-2018; at the time she was the only person I used Whatsapp to text with.)
andyferris 3y ago
It was cost. In many countries SMS was still so-and-so cents per message long after it was both free in the US and WhatsApp was born.

matt123456789 3y ago

You answered your question with your last sentence.

plumeria 3y ago

It is wild to me that someone prefers to use a medium that is not end-to-end encrypted.

changoplatanero 3y ago
I think you would find that most iphone users don't even know what end-to-end encryption is.
marcod 3y ago
I'm gonna try and channel the average user's priorities when selecting their messaging app: 1. Are the people I chat with on there? 2. Is it free? 3. Do I have to install something? 4. Is it easy to use/sign up? 5. Does it have the bells and whistles I want? .. X. What does end to end encryption mean?

andyferris 3y ago

I think built-in to your phone is part of it. It’s also very simple and replaces SMS automagically. Otherwise you need to sign up and log in to some other service. Meaning everyone you talk to needs to do the same. With the SMS fallback this doesn’t “feel” like that.

kwanbix 3y ago
Thanks, I see your point, but registering an account with WhatsApp is one of the easiest things to do, you just give your phone number, and you get an SMS that WhatsApp even reads itself (at least on android), and that's it. On the other side, with iMessage, there is a huge chance somebody does not have it, and worst, cannot have it because they don't have an iPhone. Again, 40% of the people in the USA owns an Android phone. Is a lot.
- jwestbury 3y ago
  Sure - but I can use iMessage on my phone to text those people anyway. WhatsApp has basically zero market penetration in North America, unlike Europe, so there's no network effect to speak of.
  - kwanbix 3y ago
    But you can message me, but you cannot have a group with me, you cannot send me pictures or videos with good quality, etc. I lived in the US for 1.5 years between 2010 and 2009, and we all used WhatsApp. I never heard or used iMessage.

nickthegreek 3y ago

WhatsApp is owned by Facebook. Signal is a SUPER pain in the ass, and you need a phone number. I dont know a single person who uses Telegram where I live.

garciasn 3y ago

I've never used WhatsApp, Telegram, or Signal but I have used iMessage/SMS. I really don't consider iMessage anything separate from being able to send SMSs; I just know that sometimes my messages are green and most are blue. I'd be surprised if iMessage users think as much about this as much as Android users and/or Google execs do.

deadmutex 3y ago
> I'd be surprised if iMessage users think as much about this as much as Android users and/or Google execs do. I am guessing you're not a teenager in highschool.
- nickthegreek 3y ago
  83% of teenagers in high school had iPhone in 2019. Android was 9%. So even in high school, at this point, it’s an extreme minority problem. The green bubble war is over and Apple won the youth.

kstrauser 3y ago

It’s there and it takes zero setup. I’ve never seen anything in the alternatives other than that appeals to me. With Messages.app, I can communicate with 100% of my contacts without switching apps. The question isn’t why I haven’t moved to something else, but why I would ever want to.

SirMaster 3y ago

Because if I put someone's phone number into my Messages app, 100% of people will receive my messages with no issue. To decide to use WhatsApp or Signal or Telegram etc I would have to find out if they even have that service/app set up or not. And they have to have the app installed and signed in etc. With iMessage/SMS there is no setup, no sign-in, no approval process or anything.

justsomehnguy 3y ago
Take Apple fanboying out of your mind. This is exactly how it happens, you just add someone's phone number to your address book and... and it works? All those services rely on the phone numbers to discover if you can message to the other party. You literally see if the addressee can be called/sent message through WhatsApp. Sure, it's not in your Messages app, but that's because Apple doesn't allow you to see any messaging platforms there except theirs?
- timeon 3y ago
  How it is Apple fanboying? As far as I know, every phone already has SMS by default. On iPhone some messages goes throug by iMessage - but if other side has no iMessage it is sent as SMS. I do not need to ask them to download/register on iMessages. Everyone with WhatsApp is asking me to download the app.
  - justsomehnguy 3y ago
    > Everyone with WhatsApp is asking me to download the app ... do you understand what iMessage is just another app, the only difference is what it's shipped with every iPhone and that's why it works? Apple has replaced a universal protocol, SMS, with their own app which is not available anywhere except iOS. And you are happy and try to convince everyone what this is totally fine. You are okay for people to buy an iPhone yet you are totally opposed to download a free app. Exactly what Apple wants. >> With iMessage/SMS there is no setup, no sign-in, no approval process or anything. There is a setup - buying an iOS device, there is a sign-in - creating and logging into iCloud or whatever it's called account, there is an approval process - when you create the account you give Apple all what's in the EULA and it's a lot. Oh, and if Google would replace, ahem, enhance SMS with their own proprietary app you would be the first to cry.

kelnos 3y ago

Mainly just defaults. In the US, SMS was always pretty dominant. We didn't gravitate to a single third-party platform like Whatsapp or FB Messenger or Telegram like a lot of people in other countries did. So in practice we all have lots of messaging apps installed on our phones, and SMS is still widely used. Messages is installed by default on iPhones, so people who are used to using SMS (most people) just use iMessage, and if they're communicating with someone without an iPhone, the app just degrades back to SMS.

intothemild 3y ago
What I would ultimately want from all this is that SMS goes away. That we get something better, I know there's that new protocol the IEEE have been working on, and there's RCS. I don't care which, or anything else is used, as long as it's platform independent, secure, seamless, and enables all the features of modern messaging platforms. Wife has an iPhone I have an android. One of the big problems with that downgrade is it's really one sided. An example. If I send her a photo, or video, google will send a link to it instead, unique to that message.. so she will see the full sized video or photo. If she sends me a photo or video, it uses MMS... And it's potato quality. I would settle to have apple solve that problem. Because it's solely on apple's side to solve that. But I would ultimately like there to be a successor to SMS/MMS... And soon.
- kwanbix 3y ago
  > I don't care which, or anything else is used, as long as it's platform independent, secure, seamless, and enables all the features of modern messaging platforms. You are describing WhatsApp (or telegram or signal) or am I missing something?
  - intothemild 3y ago
    I'm describing the replacement for SMS. Whatever the fallback is.

0cf8612b2e1e 3y ago

I don’t want to install Facebook anything onto my device? A company that has repeatedly engineered techniques to escape the app sandbox to exfiltrate personal data is not my friend.

ghusto 3y ago

I’ve always been curious about this too, and the answers here are not exactly enlightening. They seem to boil down to either SMS being cheaper in the U.S.A. and the lack of unlimited texting in Europe (not true), or “because I use it”. I like Messages, I think it’s great, but that doesn’t explain what happened here.

averageRoyalty 3y ago

Because most people I speak to in my non-US country don't have Signal, Telegram or WhatsApp. Or they have one of the three and I need to work out which one. Default messaging app is simpler - if they have iMessage it goes there, if not it's SMS. I can be confident of delivery, and it's no hassle.