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Dispute in the CNCF: Israelis cancel participation in Kubecon

25 points by thenaturalist 3y ago

horovits 3y ago
They couldn't bring themselves to condemn Hamas (or even mention Hamas). They couldn't openly stand with Israel after the terror attack, as it has rightfully stood with Ukraine. and with BLM. and with AAPI. and with Trans... I cancelled my KubeCon participation. here's what I wrote: https://www.linkedin.com/feed/update/urn:li:activity:7127678885260931072/ https://www.linkedin.com/feed/update/urn:li:activity:7127678...
AdamJacobMuller 3y ago
While i'm generally not a huge fan of organizations taking unrelated political stands there is important context here: > In the past, the CNCF has also clearly positioned itself on other socio-political issues. The devil is in the details on something like this though and this being a german language article i'm reading via google translate doesn't help. > The CNCF, on the other hand, has so far been silent on the terrorist attacks by Hamas. If that's entirely accurate and CNCF is refusing to condem the actions of Hamas on 10/7 that's pretty terrible and I respect the Israeli members for refusing to attend (but I find it hard to believe). If the Israeli CNCF members are asking CNCF to release a statement saying Israel should do whatever it wants to Gaza with no thought for civilians, well, CNCF is quite obviously in the right for refusing to release something like that, but again, I doubt that's what is happening and the truth is somewhere in the middle.
- wmf 3y ago
  If you condemn Hamas you're "anti-Palestine" but if you don't you're "anti-Semitic". If you say "it's complicated" you're also canceled. Truly the only winning move is not to play.
  - gkfasdfasdf 3y ago
    > If you condemn Hamas you're "anti-Palestine" This is the first time I'm hearing that sentiment. Folks who are loudly shouting "Free Palestine" are also condemning Hamas.
    - tekla 3y ago
      Bullshit. I've been to several of these protests, and I saw plenty of people holding signs indicating that any Palestinian action was justified because of Israel, pretty clearly being okay with the initial attacks.
      - nemothekid 3y ago
        Piers Morgan has spent roughly a month talking to various pro-Palestine and pro-Israeli pundits. Each one has loudly condemned Hamas; but many pro-Israeli pundits have refused to even entertain the thought that the Israeli government may be wrong in their response. I know some 19 year old at a protest makes a convenient boogeyman, but be real here, a peon at a protest holds no power. That said "what initial attacks" are you referrering to? Why is retaliation after roughly decades Israeli occupation referred to as an "initial" attack.
        AdamJacobMuller 3y ago
        This doesn't dispute that there are people out there, people who are supporters of Palestine who think that what happened on 10/7 was somehow justified. Just because Piers Morgan didn't interview them doesn't mean they don't exist. There are also plenty of pro-Palestine people who understand that Hamas is just as much of an enemy to Palestine as it is to Israel.
        juanani 3y ago
        [dead]
        pasabagi 3y ago
        I guess the difference is it's a normal position to be supportive of the IDF, or Israeli policy in Gaza. That's one side of the debate. It is absolutely not a normal position to be supportive of Hamas amongst pro-Palestinian voices. That's like a teenage edgelord position. So when you frame the debate as 'Pro-Israel' vs 'Pro-Hamas', it's just as misleading as if you framed it as 'pro nuking Palestine' vs 'pro Peace'.
  - AdamJacobMuller 3y ago
    I've long since passed the point of caring if someone wanted to "cancel" me (whatever that might mean). I will speak my mind. I've also long since passed the point of thinking it's going to do anything, but, I'll play anyway.
  - unsubstantiated 3y ago
    I'm surprised one of the options isn't "pro-them killing eachother off" because that seems like the best of the bunch.
    - Rebelgecko 3y ago
      That would be in incredibly poor taste while their colleagues/contributors are being held hostage
- Rebelgecko 3y ago
  There's probably more instances, but searching the phrase "Statement from CNCF General Manager" finds some past statements they made about bigotry, race, and violence.
aaron695 3y ago
[dead]
deleted 3y ago
[deleted]
Havoc 3y ago
> Auch zu anderen gesellschaftlich-politischen Themen hat sich die CNCF in der Vergangenheit klar positioniert. This is entirely their own fault. If a tech body repeatedly takes a position on politically sensitive matters then surprise - it gets caught in politics. Like seriously - what did they think would happen here? Just be involved in politics when convenient for virtue signally? Seems incredibly naive
cloudnativediva 3y ago
I was there. They failed to condemn Hamas and played a video of the Israeli contributors who we’ve lost and are being held hostage. I broke out sobbing and had to leave.

25 points by thenaturalist 3y ago

They couldn't bring themselves to condemn Hamas (or even mention Hamas). They couldn't openly stand with Israel after the terror attack, as it has rightfully stood with Ukraine. and with BLM. and with AAPI. and with Trans... I cancelled my KubeCon participation. here's what I wrote: https://www.linkedin.com/feed/update/urn:li:activity:7127678885260931072/ https://www.linkedin.com/feed/update/urn:li:activity:7127678...

AdamJacobMuller 3y ago

While i'm generally not a huge fan of organizations taking unrelated political stands there is important context here: > In the past, the CNCF has also clearly positioned itself on other socio-political issues. The devil is in the details on something like this though and this being a german language article i'm reading via google translate doesn't help. > The CNCF, on the other hand, has so far been silent on the terrorist attacks by Hamas. If that's entirely accurate and CNCF is refusing to condem the actions of Hamas on 10/7 that's pretty terrible and I respect the Israeli members for refusing to attend (but I find it hard to believe). If the Israeli CNCF members are asking CNCF to release a statement saying Israel should do whatever it wants to Gaza with no thought for civilians, well, CNCF is quite obviously in the right for refusing to release something like that, but again, I doubt that's what is happening and the truth is somewhere in the middle.

wmf 3y ago
If you condemn Hamas you're "anti-Palestine" but if you don't you're "anti-Semitic". If you say "it's complicated" you're also canceled. Truly the only winning move is not to play.
- gkfasdfasdf 3y ago
  > If you condemn Hamas you're "anti-Palestine" This is the first time I'm hearing that sentiment. Folks who are loudly shouting "Free Palestine" are also condemning Hamas.
  - tekla 3y ago
    Bullshit. I've been to several of these protests, and I saw plenty of people holding signs indicating that any Palestinian action was justified because of Israel, pretty clearly being okay with the initial attacks.
    - nemothekid 3y ago
      Piers Morgan has spent roughly a month talking to various pro-Palestine and pro-Israeli pundits. Each one has loudly condemned Hamas; but many pro-Israeli pundits have refused to even entertain the thought that the Israeli government may be wrong in their response. I know some 19 year old at a protest makes a convenient boogeyman, but be real here, a peon at a protest holds no power. That said "what initial attacks" are you referrering to? Why is retaliation after roughly decades Israeli occupation referred to as an "initial" attack.
      - AdamJacobMuller 3y ago
        This doesn't dispute that there are people out there, people who are supporters of Palestine who think that what happened on 10/7 was somehow justified. Just because Piers Morgan didn't interview them doesn't mean they don't exist. There are also plenty of pro-Palestine people who understand that Hamas is just as much of an enemy to Palestine as it is to Israel.
        juanani 3y ago
        [dead]
        pasabagi 3y ago
        I guess the difference is it's a normal position to be supportive of the IDF, or Israeli policy in Gaza. That's one side of the debate. It is absolutely not a normal position to be supportive of Hamas amongst pro-Palestinian voices. That's like a teenage edgelord position. So when you frame the debate as 'Pro-Israel' vs 'Pro-Hamas', it's just as misleading as if you framed it as 'pro nuking Palestine' vs 'pro Peace'.
- AdamJacobMuller 3y ago
  I've long since passed the point of caring if someone wanted to "cancel" me (whatever that might mean). I will speak my mind. I've also long since passed the point of thinking it's going to do anything, but, I'll play anyway.
- unsubstantiated 3y ago
  I'm surprised one of the options isn't "pro-them killing eachother off" because that seems like the best of the bunch.
  - Rebelgecko 3y ago
    That would be in incredibly poor taste while their colleagues/contributors are being held hostage
Rebelgecko 3y ago
There's probably more instances, but searching the phrase "Statement from CNCF General Manager" finds some past statements they made about bigotry, race, and violence.

aaron695 3y ago

[dead]

deleted 3y ago

[deleted]

Havoc 3y ago

> Auch zu anderen gesellschaftlich-politischen Themen hat sich die CNCF in der Vergangenheit klar positioniert. This is entirely their own fault. If a tech body repeatedly takes a position on politically sensitive matters then surprise - it gets caught in politics. Like seriously - what did they think would happen here? Just be involved in politics when convenient for virtue signally? Seems incredibly naive

cloudnativediva 3y ago

I was there. They failed to condemn Hamas and played a video of the Israeli contributors who we’ve lost and are being held hostage. I broke out sobbing and had to leave.