3 ms·

One should not discount the impact of climate/weather on the style of construction. Buildings enclosing gardens or a common area open to sunlight in an internal

One should not discount the impact of climate/weather on the style of construction. Buildings enclosing gardens or a common area open to sunlight in an internal square is a great idea in moderate climates, but would work poorly in heavy snow regions.

rewmie 3y ago
In Spain, most of those socialized residential housing projects were not designed with quality of life in mind. Instead, they are more in line with France's post-war operational urban planning approach mainly designed to maximize how many lower-class people could be stored in small areas. They might place a roof over your head, but apartments are extremely small with extremely small rooms, quality of life is very poor, and zoning didn't even allowed any type of non-residential use. Some neighborhoods are outright designed after prison blocks. In contrast, the middle/upper middle class residential areas often come in the form of locked up apartment blocks manned by one or more "conserges" (like a mix between a janitor and private security guard) with the ground and first floor completely locked up.
- omginternets 3y ago
  I'm not sure I agree with your characterization of post-war urban planning in France. In particular, the "HLMs" of the 60's and 70's are known for their explicit interest in providing for quality-of-life in communal living. What happened instead is that these utopian plans didn't survive contact with reality.
Tade0 3y ago
Define moderate climate. I'm currently in a building from 1990 in Eastern Europe which apparently was inspired by those in Barcelona, because it's the same shape and we have a common area with greenery and trees, but the latitude is 51° N and we used to have -30°C winters as recently as the late 90s, so I wouldn't call the climate (at least back then) moderate.
- glitchc 3y ago
  Do you get a lot of snow? How do you deal with snow accumulating in the centre?
  - stevekemp 3y ago
    I live in Helsinki, Finland, and there are often clusters of buildings arranged around a garden - with space for parking, and childrens play-areas. Snow happens every year, and it is often pushed away by mini-tractors, into giant heaps, that the children love to climb and play on. Some parts of the ground are just left covered in ice/show for a few months though.
  - dist-epoch 3y ago
    The only way to deal with it is to make "mountains" in more open spaces (squares, large intersections, ...). You can't really take it out.
    - bobthepanda 3y ago
      Fortunately, the courtyard itself is an open space, so long as you keep the paths to doors reasonably clear.
    - orangepurple 3y ago
      Montreal takes it out with huge trucks https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sNqPtNO8B5A https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sNqPtNO8B5A
  - Tade0 3y ago
    The paved areas are plowed and the rest is just left there. It's not like you have a lot of snow blowing in there in an urban environment anyway.
thebigman433 3y ago
It really isnt that bad. I lived in an apartment building in Bozeman, MT for 3 years that had an enclosed courtyard. It was pretty small and didnt get a huge amount of use anyway, so it isnt the best comparison, but overall people just sorta make do if they want to use it. You grab a shovel and clear out a bit of snow in front of the doorway to it, and then do whatever you want outside in the snow. Snowball fights, build snowmen, even bring out a bbq if you want. I could see how people would imagine that things like this wouldnt work well in a wintery climate, but overall Ive found that people just make do. They live with snow everywhere else outside, so why wouldnt they do the same in a courtyard?

rewmie 3y ago

In Spain, most of those socialized residential housing projects were not designed with quality of life in mind. Instead, they are more in line with France's post-war operational urban planning approach mainly designed to maximize how many lower-class people could be stored in small areas. They might place a roof over your head, but apartments are extremely small with extremely small rooms, quality of life is very poor, and zoning didn't even allowed any type of non-residential use. Some neighborhoods are outright designed after prison blocks. In contrast, the middle/upper middle class residential areas often come in the form of locked up apartment blocks manned by one or more "conserges" (like a mix between a janitor and private security guard) with the ground and first floor completely locked up.

omginternets 3y ago
I'm not sure I agree with your characterization of post-war urban planning in France. In particular, the "HLMs" of the 60's and 70's are known for their explicit interest in providing for quality-of-life in communal living. What happened instead is that these utopian plans didn't survive contact with reality.

Tade0 3y ago

Define moderate climate. I'm currently in a building from 1990 in Eastern Europe which apparently was inspired by those in Barcelona, because it's the same shape and we have a common area with greenery and trees, but the latitude is 51° N and we used to have -30°C winters as recently as the late 90s, so I wouldn't call the climate (at least back then) moderate.

glitchc 3y ago
Do you get a lot of snow? How do you deal with snow accumulating in the centre?
- stevekemp 3y ago
  I live in Helsinki, Finland, and there are often clusters of buildings arranged around a garden - with space for parking, and childrens play-areas. Snow happens every year, and it is often pushed away by mini-tractors, into giant heaps, that the children love to climb and play on. Some parts of the ground are just left covered in ice/show for a few months though.
- dist-epoch 3y ago
  The only way to deal with it is to make "mountains" in more open spaces (squares, large intersections, ...). You can't really take it out.
  - bobthepanda 3y ago
    Fortunately, the courtyard itself is an open space, so long as you keep the paths to doors reasonably clear.
  - orangepurple 3y ago
    Montreal takes it out with huge trucks https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sNqPtNO8B5A https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sNqPtNO8B5A
- Tade0 3y ago
  The paved areas are plowed and the rest is just left there. It's not like you have a lot of snow blowing in there in an urban environment anyway.

thebigman433 3y ago

It really isnt that bad. I lived in an apartment building in Bozeman, MT for 3 years that had an enclosed courtyard. It was pretty small and didnt get a huge amount of use anyway, so it isnt the best comparison, but overall people just sorta make do if they want to use it. You grab a shovel and clear out a bit of snow in front of the doorway to it, and then do whatever you want outside in the snow. Snowball fights, build snowmen, even bring out a bbq if you want. I could see how people would imagine that things like this wouldnt work well in a wintery climate, but overall Ive found that people just make do. They live with snow everywhere else outside, so why wouldnt they do the same in a courtyard?