4 ms·

Isn't AdaCore handling the DO-178 side? Or does Ferrocene intend to have an offering here, also?

by twoWhlsGud 3y ago

Xylakant 3y ago
The joint venture with AdaCore is no longer, so yes, we're doing this seperately.
- galangalalgol 3y ago
  Please beat them to market... Their notion of advertising "curated language features" as a positive instead of "weird frankencompiler that doesn't match any version, work with any 3rd party crates, and has complete vendor-lock" will sell well to people that already use them, unless they aren't an option.
  - sheepshear 3y ago
    I didn't think they made any language extensions for rust? Thought it was just for Ada.
    - thesuperbigfrog 3y ago
      Ada does not have any formalized FFI with Rust at this time; just C, COBOL, and Fortran: http://ada-auth.org/standards/22rm/html/RM-B.html http://ada-auth.org/standards/22rm/html/RM-B.html AdaCore has a Rust toolchain: https://www.adacore.com/gnatpro-rust https://www.adacore.com/gnatpro-rust
      - sheepshear 3y ago
        I know, thank you, but I'm asking about the "curated" language features gp is criticizing. AdaCore does make Ada language extensions (who else would push the language forward these days?), but I didn't think they had any for rust, which is why I'm asking.
        galangalalgol 3y ago
        > GNAT Pro for Rust offers yearly updates that incorporate selected, recent enhancements from the upstream development. We make sure the result is a stable, tested Rust toolchain that’s ready to be used and supported for years to come. https://www.adacore.com/gnatpro-rust https://www.adacore.com/gnatpro-rust Edit: not so worried about the extensions, more worried they will keep re-releasing 1.68 forever with features added only as people clamor for them. And security fixes wedged into old code. That is in effect forking the language.
        sheepshear 3y ago
        The direct competition between Ferrocene and AdaCore should take care of that. In any case, the compiler wouldn't be certified if they didn't vet the new features. These companies can't control what gets added to the language, and it might take longer than a year to vet future changes. Their statement is an upfront, no-bull fyi about how reality works. I highly doubt it's a statement of intent to stagnate. It would kind of defeat the purpose of switching away from a stagnated language and ecosystem.
        galangalalgol 3y ago
        I can imagine no use case where ripping out features from upstream reduces risk vs adding it. I agree it makes no sense to stagnate, but I am familiar with the certified compiler space, and what I have described is exactly what I have witnessed. Compilers that are based on ancient versions of open source compilers, and have code incorporated from various point releases since then to minimize the amount of recertification necessary.
        sheepshear 3y ago
        What happens when a new feature holds up the certification process for some reason? There are only two possible options, and they both suck: 1. Stay on the last certified version until everything is certified. 2. Incorporate the parts that can be certified.

Isn't AdaCore handling the DO-178 side? Or does Ferrocene intend to have an offering here, also?

Xylakant 3y ago

The joint venture with AdaCore is no longer, so yes, we're doing this seperately.

galangalalgol 3y ago
Please beat them to market... Their notion of advertising "curated language features" as a positive instead of "weird frankencompiler that doesn't match any version, work with any 3rd party crates, and has complete vendor-lock" will sell well to people that already use them, unless they aren't an option.
- sheepshear 3y ago
  I didn't think they made any language extensions for rust? Thought it was just for Ada.
  - thesuperbigfrog 3y ago
    Ada does not have any formalized FFI with Rust at this time; just C, COBOL, and Fortran: http://ada-auth.org/standards/22rm/html/RM-B.html http://ada-auth.org/standards/22rm/html/RM-B.html AdaCore has a Rust toolchain: https://www.adacore.com/gnatpro-rust https://www.adacore.com/gnatpro-rust
    - sheepshear 3y ago
      I know, thank you, but I'm asking about the "curated" language features gp is criticizing. AdaCore does make Ada language extensions (who else would push the language forward these days?), but I didn't think they had any for rust, which is why I'm asking.
      - galangalalgol 3y ago
        > GNAT Pro for Rust offers yearly updates that incorporate selected, recent enhancements from the upstream development. We make sure the result is a stable, tested Rust toolchain that’s ready to be used and supported for years to come. https://www.adacore.com/gnatpro-rust https://www.adacore.com/gnatpro-rust Edit: not so worried about the extensions, more worried they will keep re-releasing 1.68 forever with features added only as people clamor for them. And security fixes wedged into old code. That is in effect forking the language.
        sheepshear 3y ago
        The direct competition between Ferrocene and AdaCore should take care of that. In any case, the compiler wouldn't be certified if they didn't vet the new features. These companies can't control what gets added to the language, and it might take longer than a year to vet future changes. Their statement is an upfront, no-bull fyi about how reality works. I highly doubt it's a statement of intent to stagnate. It would kind of defeat the purpose of switching away from a stagnated language and ecosystem.
        galangalalgol 3y ago
        I can imagine no use case where ripping out features from upstream reduces risk vs adding it. I agree it makes no sense to stagnate, but I am familiar with the certified compiler space, and what I have described is exactly what I have witnessed. Compilers that are based on ancient versions of open source compilers, and have code incorporated from various point releases since then to minimize the amount of recertification necessary.
        sheepshear 3y ago
        What happens when a new feature holds up the certification process for some reason? There are only two possible options, and they both suck: 1. Stay on the last certified version until everything is certified. 2. Incorporate the parts that can be certified.