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I always hate these kind of conversation advice/social advice blog post things because the reality is that you can be an excellent conversationalist and make fr

I always hate these kind of conversation advice/social advice blog post things because the reality is that you can be an excellent conversationalist and make friends with everyone with all different conversational styles. I have friends that talk about themselves 75% of the conversation but nobody gives a shit because they’re interesting/funny/unusual/whatever and people like to be entertained. Similarly I have friends that typically talk very little about themselves - few short sentences and back to you - and that works too! You can be the kind of person who uses someone’s name all the time or literally never uses it and BOTH of those work just fine. You know what doesn’t work though? Weird advice about making it about them, or mentioning their name X times, or other specific rules. You can spot someone who just read How To Make Friends or whatever else a mile away - why? Because they seem to be nervously following some invisible rule and it ends up making them seem like a kid from the school paper conducting their first interview. You know what DOES work every time? Having a relaxed, natural conversation! “Have a few beers and relax and just talk normally” is better advice than any blog post or self help book out there.

distcs 3y ago
If you do not want to see articles like this on HN, you can always flag it to seek moderator attention. The author aksh7i seems to be using HN purely for self promotion who posts self-help (and dare I say, offtopic) stuff like this. Their last post was flagged too: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37963914 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37963914 And in the first comment in that flagged article, they were made aware of their inappropriate and blatant self-promotional behavior: > OP, every single one of your submissions is a blog post of your own, and every single one of your comments is a non sequitur on one of those submissions, apparently in an attempt to boost it. Get that kind of drivel off HN. > Also, this particular article is nearly 100% insight-free, rehashed, productivity influencer pablum. They choose to continue spamming HN regardless.
ShamelessC 3y ago
certain personality types don’t just talk about themselves but rather lack awareness of others and don’t know how to read the room, as you suggest they should. Really, these people are unlikely to change, much less realize they are bothering anyone or appear selfish. And indeed, trying to follow a set of rules laid out on the internet would just shine a light on it.
owenversteeg 3y ago
This has gotten a ton of votes in only a few minutes, so I figured I’d add: If you want to get deeper into this - very few people can have a conversation, discreetly think about something unrelated at the same time, and then change the conversation accordingly. If you’re one of the few that can do this you’re definitely not taking conversation advice from a poorly written blog. There’s nothing that throws off a conversation faster than the other person clearly _thinking_ about the conversation. Doing that is also a social signal the size of Texas that you don’t have normal conversations. Just relaxing and talking normally, even if you talk about yourself, even if you never say their name, even if you bring up politics, even if you break every rule in the internet conversation blogger rulebook? That’s a social signal that you DO have normal social interactions. Relax and just talk like you normally do, not like some blogger told you.
The_Colonel 3y ago
> I have friends that talk about themselves 75% of the conversation but nobody gives a shit because they’re interesting/funny/unusual/whatever and people like to be entertained. What if you're talking 75% of the conversation, but the content isn't particularly interesting/funny? Is that still fine? > Having a relaxed, natural conversation! “Have a few beers and relax and just talk normally” Where "natural" and "normal" is completely clear and self-evident to everybody. Most of these advices are targeted at people who struggle with social interactions. Many people are lonely without friends and bad habits like talking only about themselves won't help with that. If you have great social interactions then great! You likely don't need such advice. (Although I think most people could learn some "tricks" to improve their relationships)
- owenversteeg 3y ago
  Natural is just that, natural. I have never met a human being alive that has never had a natural conversation and yes that includes people with strong social anxiety, autism, you name it. Maybe that’s when you talk to your mother, or when you’re drunk, or when you’re talking to your best friend, or you live in a basement and it’s some guy over voice chat in a game or whatever but I guarantee you have had at least one. Pretty sure everyone knows what “relax” means. I never said you should talk ONLY about yourself. I just said that a realistic conversation can be all over the place and the exact split doesn’t matter.
  - tragicfootball 3y ago
    Pretty sure not everyone knows what "relax" means. People who overthink, people who go to therapy, people who have mental problems. Do you just tell them "come on, you KNOW what relax means!" Even if you had a "natural convo" with them, you'll never know if they were STRUGGLING to have this "natural convo" with you. I assume you work in software since this is HN. Never assume you know about your users. Please.
    - owenversteeg 3y ago
      This is such an incredibly weird response, did you even read my comment properly? You think people who go to therapy or overthink don’t even know what it is to relax? Not even that they can’t relax but that they don’t even know what it means? I never said anything about perceiving anyone else’s struggle or issues… that’s an entirely different subject.
gilleain 3y ago
> or mentioning their name X times Reminds me of this : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1W34wyKZlWQ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1W34wyKZlWQ (Mitchell and Webb, 'People Person' sketch). Yes, it's obvious when people do this, and unconvincing.
- owenversteeg 3y ago
  Ah, I love Mitchell and Webb! Somehow I forgot about that sketch but yes it’s absolutely spot on as usual.
melvinmelih 3y ago
> You can spot someone who just read How To Make Friends or whatever else a mile away - why? Because they seem to be nervously following some invisible rule and it ends up making them seem like a kid from the school paper conducting their first interview I had dinner once with an acquaintance in the industry who did this. Every interaction we had with someone else (hostess, waiter, etc) he made it a point to stop them and ask their name. It was incredibly awkward because there was no point in knowing everyone’s name.

distcs 3y ago

If you do not want to see articles like this on HN, you can always flag it to seek moderator attention. The author aksh7i seems to be using HN purely for self promotion who posts self-help (and dare I say, offtopic) stuff like this. Their last post was flagged too: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37963914 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37963914 And in the first comment in that flagged article, they were made aware of their inappropriate and blatant self-promotional behavior: > OP, every single one of your submissions is a blog post of your own, and every single one of your comments is a non sequitur on one of those submissions, apparently in an attempt to boost it. Get that kind of drivel off HN. > Also, this particular article is nearly 100% insight-free, rehashed, productivity influencer pablum. They choose to continue spamming HN regardless.

ShamelessC 3y ago

certain personality types don’t just talk about themselves but rather lack awareness of others and don’t know how to read the room, as you suggest they should. Really, these people are unlikely to change, much less realize they are bothering anyone or appear selfish. And indeed, trying to follow a set of rules laid out on the internet would just shine a light on it.

owenversteeg 3y ago

This has gotten a ton of votes in only a few minutes, so I figured I’d add: If you want to get deeper into this - very few people can have a conversation, discreetly think about something unrelated at the same time, and then change the conversation accordingly. If you’re one of the few that can do this you’re definitely not taking conversation advice from a poorly written blog. There’s nothing that throws off a conversation faster than the other person clearly _thinking_ about the conversation. Doing that is also a social signal the size of Texas that you don’t have normal conversations. Just relaxing and talking normally, even if you talk about yourself, even if you never say their name, even if you bring up politics, even if you break every rule in the internet conversation blogger rulebook? That’s a social signal that you DO have normal social interactions. Relax and just talk like you normally do, not like some blogger told you.

The_Colonel 3y ago

> I have friends that talk about themselves 75% of the conversation but nobody gives a shit because they’re interesting/funny/unusual/whatever and people like to be entertained. What if you're talking 75% of the conversation, but the content isn't particularly interesting/funny? Is that still fine? > Having a relaxed, natural conversation! “Have a few beers and relax and just talk normally” Where "natural" and "normal" is completely clear and self-evident to everybody. Most of these advices are targeted at people who struggle with social interactions. Many people are lonely without friends and bad habits like talking only about themselves won't help with that. If you have great social interactions then great! You likely don't need such advice. (Although I think most people could learn some "tricks" to improve their relationships)

owenversteeg 3y ago
Natural is just that, natural. I have never met a human being alive that has never had a natural conversation and yes that includes people with strong social anxiety, autism, you name it. Maybe that’s when you talk to your mother, or when you’re drunk, or when you’re talking to your best friend, or you live in a basement and it’s some guy over voice chat in a game or whatever but I guarantee you have had at least one. Pretty sure everyone knows what “relax” means. I never said you should talk ONLY about yourself. I just said that a realistic conversation can be all over the place and the exact split doesn’t matter.
- tragicfootball 3y ago
  Pretty sure not everyone knows what "relax" means. People who overthink, people who go to therapy, people who have mental problems. Do you just tell them "come on, you KNOW what relax means!" Even if you had a "natural convo" with them, you'll never know if they were STRUGGLING to have this "natural convo" with you. I assume you work in software since this is HN. Never assume you know about your users. Please.
  - owenversteeg 3y ago
    This is such an incredibly weird response, did you even read my comment properly? You think people who go to therapy or overthink don’t even know what it is to relax? Not even that they can’t relax but that they don’t even know what it means? I never said anything about perceiving anyone else’s struggle or issues… that’s an entirely different subject.

gilleain 3y ago

> or mentioning their name X times Reminds me of this : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1W34wyKZlWQ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1W34wyKZlWQ (Mitchell and Webb, 'People Person' sketch). Yes, it's obvious when people do this, and unconvincing.

owenversteeg 3y ago
Ah, I love Mitchell and Webb! Somehow I forgot about that sketch but yes it’s absolutely spot on as usual.

melvinmelih 3y ago

> You can spot someone who just read How To Make Friends or whatever else a mile away - why? Because they seem to be nervously following some invisible rule and it ends up making them seem like a kid from the school paper conducting their first interview I had dinner once with an acquaintance in the industry who did this. Every interaction we had with someone else (hostess, waiter, etc) he made it a point to stop them and ask their name. It was incredibly awkward because there was no point in knowing everyone’s name.