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> You have no idea what the challenges are or how the development process works for this project. The magic of the open source gives you the possibility to see

by reisse 3y ago

> You have no idea what the challenges are or how the development process works for this project. The magic of the open source gives you the possibility to see it. And I do sometimes take a look into a shitshow of management which is this three years old triple buffering MR [1]. Don't get me wrong, I didn't examine the code thoroughly, it might be a marvel of engineering, but when it takes you more than three years (and counting!) to land a feature, to the point where some people start to forgot why it was even necessary in the first place [2], and when downstream has to monkey-patch your feature as-is because the benefits are so big [3], you cannot say your development processes are alright. And it's not only triple buffering, you can see the same pattern in the MR for VRR [4]. 1. https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/mutter/-/merge_requests/1441 https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/mutter/-/merge_requests/1441 2. https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/mutter/-/merge_requests/1441#note_1803686 https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/mutter/-/merge_requests/1441#... 3. https://discourse.ubuntu.com/t/why-ubuntu-22-04-is-so-fast-and-how-to-make-it-faster/30369 https://discourse.ubuntu.com/t/why-ubuntu-22-04-is-so-fast-a... 4. https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/mutter/-/merge_requests/1154 https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/mutter/-/merge_requests/1154

tuna74 3y ago
You can see a lot of bugs found (and being fixed) in that MR. Should Gnome add lots of new bugs for little gain?
- reisse 3y ago
  I won't answer this question because Canonical did it for me. As I mentioned in the parent post, they considered the gain so important that Ubuntu ships triple buffering patch starting from 22.04 LTS. Well, they actually come up with this feature - Daniel Van Vugt, author of the patch (huuuuge thank you, by the way) works for Canonical. So yeah, I promised not to answer, but I'd say GNOME should definitely have upstreamed the changes much earlier.
  - asdajksah2123 3y ago
    And that's a good thing. Gnome is not a distro. It doesn't provide a user facing distro. It's a DE that other people are building the largest distros on. They should be adding stuff based on their priorities, while Gnome's priority should be advancing the DE while ensuring their DE does not break all the many major distros that are based off Gnome. It's a good thing that the distros can then add/fix stuff based on their priorities. That's what open development is about. That's what allows Canonical to differentiate from a Fedora. How they choose to prioritize the features/fixes they build on top of Gnome.
asdajksah2123 3y ago
And yet somehow despite Gnome's shitshow management, all the major distros default to GNOME. Maybe they're doing something right?
- ahgshando6698 3y ago
  [dead]
- reisse 3y ago
  > all the major distros default to GNOME If your definition of major distros is limited to Ubuntu, Debian and Fedora, then probably. Linux Mint was born out of rejecting GNOME, Arch is not opinionated, Manjaro defaults to KDE (although "defaults" here may be a wrong word), SteamOS defaults to KDE, openSUSE defaults to KDE, then there's PopOS...

by reisse 3y ago

tuna74 3y ago

You can see a lot of bugs found (and being fixed) in that MR. Should Gnome add lots of new bugs for little gain?

reisse 3y ago
I won't answer this question because Canonical did it for me. As I mentioned in the parent post, they considered the gain so important that Ubuntu ships triple buffering patch starting from 22.04 LTS. Well, they actually come up with this feature - Daniel Van Vugt, author of the patch (huuuuge thank you, by the way) works for Canonical. So yeah, I promised not to answer, but I'd say GNOME should definitely have upstreamed the changes much earlier.
- asdajksah2123 3y ago
  And that's a good thing. Gnome is not a distro. It doesn't provide a user facing distro. It's a DE that other people are building the largest distros on. They should be adding stuff based on their priorities, while Gnome's priority should be advancing the DE while ensuring their DE does not break all the many major distros that are based off Gnome. It's a good thing that the distros can then add/fix stuff based on their priorities. That's what open development is about. That's what allows Canonical to differentiate from a Fedora. How they choose to prioritize the features/fixes they build on top of Gnome.

asdajksah2123 3y ago

And yet somehow despite Gnome's shitshow management, all the major distros default to GNOME. Maybe they're doing something right?

ahgshando6698 3y ago
[dead]
reisse 3y ago
> all the major distros default to GNOME If your definition of major distros is limited to Ubuntu, Debian and Fedora, then probably. Linux Mint was born out of rejecting GNOME, Arch is not opinionated, Manjaro defaults to KDE (although "defaults" here may be a wrong word), SteamOS defaults to KDE, openSUSE defaults to KDE, then there's PopOS...