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And despite the fact that the CEOs are all able to have like five different side hustles, they still get to drone on endlessly about how hard they work, and do

And despite the fact that the CEOs are all able to have like five different side hustles, they still get to drone on endlessly about how hard they work, and do not see the hypocrisy with making all the employees sign overly broad "non-competes".

JohnFen 3y ago
Well, sure! We're untrustworthy plebes who would certainly drain company resources to support our "side hustles". The people who become CEOs are virtuous hyperperforming knights who always do everything right. /s
- tombert 3y ago
  Probably the most trouble I got into when I was at Apple was when I emailed a VP directly asking if I could maybe contribute some code (in my own time, on my own hardware, at home) to an open source project. The VP didn't just say "no", but also ratted me out to like the six managers between me and him, and each manager thought it was a good use of company time to schedule half-hour meetings explaining to me that I needed to go through the proper bureaucratic channels because the VP's time is "extremely valuable". Honestly kind of poisoned the entire job for me.
  - erulabs 3y ago
    Haha, what's funny there is the idea that if they paid the VP less maybe it would be worth this time to engage with his employees.
  - subw00f 3y ago
    Why would you ask that? It’s literally your time and resources.
    - tombert 3y ago
      Apple made it pretty clear that they viewed pretty much any code that I wrote while I was employed by them, by default, belonged to them. If I contributed to an open source repo without legal's explicit approval, it was grounds for termination. It was ridiculous.
      - JohnFen 3y ago
        I've encountered this sort of clause in about 2/3 of the employment contracts I've been presented with. Every time, I object to it and request that it be removed and replaced with wording to the effect of "I won't use company time, resources, or information in side projects". Every time I've done this, they've agreed to the change. If they don't, then I don't take the job.
  - johnnyanmac 3y ago
    Sounds like that happened a long time ago, my condolences. Non-competes don't mean shit and 99% of them in CA are illegal these days unless you are extremely high up (having 6 managers between you and a VP doesn't seem to satisfy that). Hope you did it anyway. No one should be able to tell you what you can do in your spare time.
    - tombert 3y ago
      This was early 2020; is that a long time ago? Time has no meaning after COVID. I mean, I wasn't worried about them suing me for contributing to open source (it would be pretty hard to prove any real damages), but I think being fired would have been on the table.
  - lotsoweiners 3y ago
    I also heard you’d been having problems with your TPS reports. Didn’t you get the memo?
    - tombert 3y ago
      My wife basically made the Office Space joke when it happened, how I had like six half-hour meetings in one day to explain how I screwed up on some arbitrary rule.
      - westmeal 3y ago
        Six. Six managers Bob.
dpkirchner 3y ago
And then a lot of CEOs with their side hustles claim that remote work is "morally wrong" or whatever.

JohnFen 3y ago

Well, sure! We're untrustworthy plebes who would certainly drain company resources to support our "side hustles". The people who become CEOs are virtuous hyperperforming knights who always do everything right. /s

tombert 3y ago
Probably the most trouble I got into when I was at Apple was when I emailed a VP directly asking if I could maybe contribute some code (in my own time, on my own hardware, at home) to an open source project. The VP didn't just say "no", but also ratted me out to like the six managers between me and him, and each manager thought it was a good use of company time to schedule half-hour meetings explaining to me that I needed to go through the proper bureaucratic channels because the VP's time is "extremely valuable". Honestly kind of poisoned the entire job for me.
- erulabs 3y ago
  Haha, what's funny there is the idea that if they paid the VP less maybe it would be worth this time to engage with his employees.
- subw00f 3y ago
  Why would you ask that? It’s literally your time and resources.
  - tombert 3y ago
    Apple made it pretty clear that they viewed pretty much any code that I wrote while I was employed by them, by default, belonged to them. If I contributed to an open source repo without legal's explicit approval, it was grounds for termination. It was ridiculous.
    - JohnFen 3y ago
      I've encountered this sort of clause in about 2/3 of the employment contracts I've been presented with. Every time, I object to it and request that it be removed and replaced with wording to the effect of "I won't use company time, resources, or information in side projects". Every time I've done this, they've agreed to the change. If they don't, then I don't take the job.
- johnnyanmac 3y ago
  Sounds like that happened a long time ago, my condolences. Non-competes don't mean shit and 99% of them in CA are illegal these days unless you are extremely high up (having 6 managers between you and a VP doesn't seem to satisfy that). Hope you did it anyway. No one should be able to tell you what you can do in your spare time.
  - tombert 3y ago
    This was early 2020; is that a long time ago? Time has no meaning after COVID. I mean, I wasn't worried about them suing me for contributing to open source (it would be pretty hard to prove any real damages), but I think being fired would have been on the table.
- lotsoweiners 3y ago
  I also heard you’d been having problems with your TPS reports. Didn’t you get the memo?
  - tombert 3y ago
    My wife basically made the Office Space joke when it happened, how I had like six half-hour meetings in one day to explain how I screwed up on some arbitrary rule.
    - westmeal 3y ago
      Six. Six managers Bob.

dpkirchner 3y ago

And then a lot of CEOs with their side hustles claim that remote work is "morally wrong" or whatever.