3 ms·

This is a cool project but I strongly disagree with its premise that we would need machines with "more personality". I don't want that. I want machines that a

by bambax 3y ago

This is a cool project but I strongly disagree with its premise that we would need machines with "more personality". I don't want that. I want machines that are predictable; not "intelligent" ones that may do one thing one time and another thing another time, for no discernible reason. I expect machines to be deterministic.

crystaln 3y ago
What if the machine is a comedian?
deleted 3y ago
[deleted]
Traubenfuchs 3y ago
Why not both? Someone might want to talk to a hologram of their celebrity crush in a skimpy outfit that always talks in a submissive way and sultry voice, while someone else might want a disembodied voice without discernible sex.
- Sander_Marechal 3y ago
  I just want Majel Barrett's disembodied voice echoing through my room :-)
  - dotancohen 3y ago
    Bonus points for asking for information in a flat unemotional Brent Spiner voice.
stevekemp 3y ago
If you mention "personality", in the context of robots, the first thing that comes to mind is Marvin the paranoid Android, from Douglas Adams. He famously built Marvin with 'Genuine People Personality', though it seems to do little good for him, or those around him for that matter.
no_time 3y ago
There is clearly a demand for personality too. I was reading some chatGPT programming workflow Twitter thread the other day and the guy was unusually polite with the thing. Like, does saying "please" or "thank you" actually improve its performance or is it just tech roleplay?
- dotancohen 3y ago
  Yes, in the early days of ChatGPT I had noticed that polite conversation leads to less adversarial responses. In retrospect it does seem logical that a language model would choose more amenable responses and be more willing to help when spoken nicely to. I do not know if that behavior has been programmed out of it by now, I simply talk nicely to it with please and thank you out of habit at this point.
- tgv 3y ago
  > There is clearly a demand for personality too. Offer people sugar, and they get obese. Demand doesn't justify anything.
  - krisoft 3y ago
    The person who started the thread said "I don't want that." Explaining that other people do want that is a perfectly valid response. If you would like to further elaborate on why you think sugar is the right analogy here that would be very welcome too of course.
    - tgv 3y ago
      TL;DR demand is no justification.
- TeMPOraL 3y ago
  Saying "please" and "thank you" is hardly dealing with a personality. It's civilized behavior 101, and arguably not doing it is what takes effort.
xboxnolifes 3y ago
what about machines for entertainment?
alpaca128 3y ago
I generally agree but part of the purpose of machines like AI is unpredictability. For example that AI girlfriend trend started exactly because LLMs can now produce more varied output than a Skyrim NPC* while making more sense than a random word generator. *Of course not including the new LLM-based Skyrim NPC mods
flir 3y ago
I bet you lose out in the marketplace. The same selection pressure that drives neoteny will drive the evolution of hardware-with-a-personality. Compare Bratz dolls with Barbie dolls. Or even a 1960s Barbie with a 2020s Barbie, to a degree.
- demondemidi 3y ago
  Yes yes, the market rules all and is always correct, amiright? Some of us don’t want the world ruled by the biggest company that won the game of capitalism.
  - flir 3y ago
    Even if every robot was artisanally hand-made by Sandbenders in deepest Oregon, I predict the cute robots would still be more popular. It's not capitalism that's providing the selection pressure, it's our own evolution. Given time, we'll find out. Maybe I'm completely wrong.
- bambax 3y ago
  You're partly right. The demand for "smart" machines, for some reason, indeed seems larger. But there should be room for both.
zoeysmithe 3y ago
This is the classic HAL vs the Star Trek "computer" question. I think initially things like Alexa, Siri and Google Home were so much verbose and personality based and now just barely speak and don't do any fun personality stuff, outside of kid-centric features like "guess the animal game", bedtime stories, etc. I think people are just too busy or in a hurry to deal with personality from technology. In fact, Cortana has entirely been cancelled and replaced with a faceless and nameless Bing Enterprise Chat. Another case is how stoic and boring and lifeless ChatGPT is compared to some of these more personality based AIs out there. People just want the facts and not to be bothered. They actually don't want a virtual friend. Things like MS Bob, Cortana, and various avatars and personality-based agents keep failing compared to simple and fast interfaces. I think that'll probably stick with robotics too. I think the Star Trek "computer" will win out every time. People just want to feel empowered and have a minimal of their time and effort spent.
- famouswaffles 3y ago
  Siri, Alexa and Cortana all sucked. They simply weren't smart or robust enough for the whole personality thing to work. This has clearly changed. LLMs will literally perform better with emotionally fused text. https://arxiv.org/abs/2307.11760 https://arxiv.org/abs/2307.11760 Bing may be faceless and nameless but i assure you, it's definitely not personality-less. Character ai is very popular and is based on personality infused LLM instances. There is clearly a big market here. That Open ai try their best to train the personality out of their LLMs by default is not indication there isn't. https://beta.character.ai/ https://beta.character.ai/ https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=ai.character.app&hl=en_CA&gl=US https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=ai.character.a... Then you have Disney working on things like this. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-cfIm06tcfA https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-cfIm06tcfA If you don't think this is potentially a billion dollar market then i don't know what to say. It absolutely is.
btbuildem 3y ago
What about the "marines" robots in Interstellar?

by bambax 3y ago

crystaln 3y ago

What if the machine is a comedian?

deleted 3y ago

[deleted]

Traubenfuchs 3y ago

Why not both? Someone might want to talk to a hologram of their celebrity crush in a skimpy outfit that always talks in a submissive way and sultry voice, while someone else might want a disembodied voice without discernible sex.

Sander_Marechal 3y ago
I just want Majel Barrett's disembodied voice echoing through my room :-)
- dotancohen 3y ago
  Bonus points for asking for information in a flat unemotional Brent Spiner voice.

stevekemp 3y ago

If you mention "personality", in the context of robots, the first thing that comes to mind is Marvin the paranoid Android, from Douglas Adams. He famously built Marvin with 'Genuine People Personality', though it seems to do little good for him, or those around him for that matter.

no_time 3y ago

There is clearly a demand for personality too. I was reading some chatGPT programming workflow Twitter thread the other day and the guy was unusually polite with the thing. Like, does saying "please" or "thank you" actually improve its performance or is it just tech roleplay?

dotancohen 3y ago
Yes, in the early days of ChatGPT I had noticed that polite conversation leads to less adversarial responses. In retrospect it does seem logical that a language model would choose more amenable responses and be more willing to help when spoken nicely to. I do not know if that behavior has been programmed out of it by now, I simply talk nicely to it with please and thank you out of habit at this point.
tgv 3y ago
> There is clearly a demand for personality too. Offer people sugar, and they get obese. Demand doesn't justify anything.
- krisoft 3y ago
  The person who started the thread said "I don't want that." Explaining that other people do want that is a perfectly valid response. If you would like to further elaborate on why you think sugar is the right analogy here that would be very welcome too of course.
  - tgv 3y ago
    TL;DR demand is no justification.
TeMPOraL 3y ago
Saying "please" and "thank you" is hardly dealing with a personality. It's civilized behavior 101, and arguably not doing it is what takes effort.

xboxnolifes 3y ago

what about machines for entertainment?

alpaca128 3y ago

I generally agree but part of the purpose of machines like AI is unpredictability. For example that AI girlfriend trend started exactly because LLMs can now produce more varied output than a Skyrim NPC* while making more sense than a random word generator. *Of course not including the new LLM-based Skyrim NPC mods

flir 3y ago

I bet you lose out in the marketplace. The same selection pressure that drives neoteny will drive the evolution of hardware-with-a-personality. Compare Bratz dolls with Barbie dolls. Or even a 1960s Barbie with a 2020s Barbie, to a degree.

demondemidi 3y ago
Yes yes, the market rules all and is always correct, amiright? Some of us don’t want the world ruled by the biggest company that won the game of capitalism.
- flir 3y ago
  Even if every robot was artisanally hand-made by Sandbenders in deepest Oregon, I predict the cute robots would still be more popular. It's not capitalism that's providing the selection pressure, it's our own evolution. Given time, we'll find out. Maybe I'm completely wrong.
bambax 3y ago
You're partly right. The demand for "smart" machines, for some reason, indeed seems larger. But there should be room for both.

zoeysmithe 3y ago

This is the classic HAL vs the Star Trek "computer" question. I think initially things like Alexa, Siri and Google Home were so much verbose and personality based and now just barely speak and don't do any fun personality stuff, outside of kid-centric features like "guess the animal game", bedtime stories, etc. I think people are just too busy or in a hurry to deal with personality from technology. In fact, Cortana has entirely been cancelled and replaced with a faceless and nameless Bing Enterprise Chat. Another case is how stoic and boring and lifeless ChatGPT is compared to some of these more personality based AIs out there. People just want the facts and not to be bothered. They actually don't want a virtual friend. Things like MS Bob, Cortana, and various avatars and personality-based agents keep failing compared to simple and fast interfaces. I think that'll probably stick with robotics too. I think the Star Trek "computer" will win out every time. People just want to feel empowered and have a minimal of their time and effort spent.

famouswaffles 3y ago
Siri, Alexa and Cortana all sucked. They simply weren't smart or robust enough for the whole personality thing to work. This has clearly changed. LLMs will literally perform better with emotionally fused text. https://arxiv.org/abs/2307.11760 https://arxiv.org/abs/2307.11760 Bing may be faceless and nameless but i assure you, it's definitely not personality-less. Character ai is very popular and is based on personality infused LLM instances. There is clearly a big market here. That Open ai try their best to train the personality out of their LLMs by default is not indication there isn't. https://beta.character.ai/ https://beta.character.ai/ https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=ai.character.app&hl=en_CA&gl=US https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=ai.character.a... Then you have Disney working on things like this. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-cfIm06tcfA https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-cfIm06tcfA If you don't think this is potentially a billion dollar market then i don't know what to say. It absolutely is.

btbuildem 3y ago

What about the "marines" robots in Interstellar?