4 ms·

For a bit of reference, a full frame of Crysis (benchmark scene) was around 300k vertices or triangles (memory is fuzzy), so 3-10 log piles depending on which w

For a bit of reference, a full frame of Crysis (benchmark scene) was around 300k vertices or triangles (memory is fuzzy), so 3-10 log piles depending on which way my memory is off and how bad the vertex/triangle ratio is in each.

ReactiveJelly 3y ago
Sounds right. I remember seeing "1M Triangles" in the performance HUD and thinking, that's crazy, a million triangles. Probably very few shared vertices once you account for edge splits, billboards, etc.
paavohtl 3y ago
Author here: I never bothered counting the total vertices used per frame because I couldn't figure out an easy way to do it in Renderdoc. However someone on Reddit measured the total vertex count with ReShade and it can apparently reach hundreds of millions and up to 1 billion vertices in closeups in large cities. Edit: Checked the vert & poly counts with Renderdoc. The example scene in the article processes 121 million vertices and over 40 million triangles.
- jiggawatts 3y ago
  “If you’ve used more triangles than there are pixels on the screen, you’ve messed up.” I call this kind of thing the “kilobyte rule” because a similar common problem is shoving tens of megabytes of JSON down the wire to display about a kilobyte of text in a browser.
  - Sohcahtoa82 3y ago
    I'd think today's problem is tens of megabytes of JavaScript to display a couple kilobytes of text.
  - kgabis 3y ago
    Well, not anymore, Epic's Nanite is basically a triangle per pixel rendering.
    - jiggawatts 3y ago
      It’s actually very nearly optimal: using as many triangles as needed to display as much detail as possible while staying under the one triangle per pixel limit. That’s the opposite of using 10K pixels to render two pixels on the screen.
- westurner 3y ago
  > The issues are luckily quite easy to fix, both by creating more LOD variants and by improving the culling system How many polygons are there with and without e.g. AutoLOD/InstaLOD? An LLM can probably be trained to simplify meshes and create LOD variants with e.g. UnityMeshSimplifier? Whinarn/UnityMeshSimplifier: https://github.com/Whinarn/UnityMeshSimplifier https://github.com/Whinarn/UnityMeshSimplifier : > Mesh simplification for Unity. The project is deeply based on the Fast Quadric Mesh Simplification algorithm, but rewritten entirely in C# and released under the MIT license. Mesh.Optimize: https://docs.unity3d.com/ScriptReference/Mesh.Optimize.html https://docs.unity3d.com/ScriptReference/Mesh.Optimize.html Unity-Technologies/AutoLOD: https://github.com/Unity-Technologies/AutoLOD https://github.com/Unity-Technologies/AutoLOD "Unity Labs: AutoLOD - Experimenting with automatic performance improvements" https://blog.unity.com/technology/unity-labs-autolod-experimenting-with-automatic-performance-improvements https://blog.unity.com/technology/unity-labs-autolod-experim... InstaLOD: https://github.com/InstaLOD https://github.com/InstaLOD "Simulated Mesh Simplifier": https://github.com/Unity-Technologies/AutoLOD/issues/4 https://github.com/Unity-Technologies/AutoLOD/issues/4 : > Yes, we had started work on a GPU-accelerated simplifier using QEM, but it was not robust enough to release. "Any chance of getting official support now that Unreal has shown off it's AutoLOD?" https://github.com/Unity-Technologies/AutoLOD/issues/71#issuecomment-898980626 https://github.com/Unity-Technologies/AutoLOD/issues/71#issu... : > "UE4 has had automatic LOD generation since it first released - I was honestly baffled when I realized that Unity was missing what I had assumed to be a basic feature.* > Note that Nanite (which I assume you're referring to) is not a LOD system, despite being similar in the basic goal of not rendering as many polygons for distant objects. "Unity: Feature Request: Auto - LOD" (2023-05) https://forum.unity.com/threads/auto-lod.1440610/ https://forum.unity.com/threads/auto-lod.1440610/ "Discussion about Virtualized Geometry (as introduced by UE5)" https://github.com/godotengine/godot-proposals/issues/2793 https://github.com/godotengine/godot-proposals/issues/2793 UE5 Unreal Engine 5 docs > Rendering features > Nanite: https://docs.unrealengine.com/5.0/en-US/RenderingFeatures/Nanite/ https://docs.unrealengine.com/5.0/en-US/RenderingFeatures/Na... Unity-GPU-Based-Occlusion-Culling: https://github.com/przemyslawzaworski/Unity-GPU-Based-Occlusion-Culling/tree/master https://github.com/przemyslawzaworski/Unity-GPU-Based-Occlus...
  - westurner 3y ago

ReactiveJelly 3y ago

Sounds right. I remember seeing "1M Triangles" in the performance HUD and thinking, that's crazy, a million triangles. Probably very few shared vertices once you account for edge splits, billboards, etc.

paavohtl 3y ago

Author here: I never bothered counting the total vertices used per frame because I couldn't figure out an easy way to do it in Renderdoc. However someone on Reddit measured the total vertex count with ReShade and it can apparently reach hundreds of millions and up to 1 billion vertices in closeups in large cities. Edit: Checked the vert & poly counts with Renderdoc. The example scene in the article processes 121 million vertices and over 40 million triangles.

jiggawatts 3y ago
“If you’ve used more triangles than there are pixels on the screen, you’ve messed up.” I call this kind of thing the “kilobyte rule” because a similar common problem is shoving tens of megabytes of JSON down the wire to display about a kilobyte of text in a browser.
- Sohcahtoa82 3y ago
  I'd think today's problem is tens of megabytes of JavaScript to display a couple kilobytes of text.
- kgabis 3y ago
  Well, not anymore, Epic's Nanite is basically a triangle per pixel rendering.
  - jiggawatts 3y ago
    It’s actually very nearly optimal: using as many triangles as needed to display as much detail as possible while staying under the one triangle per pixel limit. That’s the opposite of using 10K pixels to render two pixels on the screen.
westurner 3y ago
> The issues are luckily quite easy to fix, both by creating more LOD variants and by improving the culling system How many polygons are there with and without e.g. AutoLOD/InstaLOD? An LLM can probably be trained to simplify meshes and create LOD variants with e.g. UnityMeshSimplifier? Whinarn/UnityMeshSimplifier: https://github.com/Whinarn/UnityMeshSimplifier https://github.com/Whinarn/UnityMeshSimplifier : > Mesh simplification for Unity. The project is deeply based on the Fast Quadric Mesh Simplification algorithm, but rewritten entirely in C# and released under the MIT license. Mesh.Optimize: https://docs.unity3d.com/ScriptReference/Mesh.Optimize.html https://docs.unity3d.com/ScriptReference/Mesh.Optimize.html Unity-Technologies/AutoLOD: https://github.com/Unity-Technologies/AutoLOD https://github.com/Unity-Technologies/AutoLOD "Unity Labs: AutoLOD - Experimenting with automatic performance improvements" https://blog.unity.com/technology/unity-labs-autolod-experimenting-with-automatic-performance-improvements https://blog.unity.com/technology/unity-labs-autolod-experim... InstaLOD: https://github.com/InstaLOD https://github.com/InstaLOD "Simulated Mesh Simplifier": https://github.com/Unity-Technologies/AutoLOD/issues/4 https://github.com/Unity-Technologies/AutoLOD/issues/4 : > Yes, we had started work on a GPU-accelerated simplifier using QEM, but it was not robust enough to release. "Any chance of getting official support now that Unreal has shown off it's AutoLOD?" https://github.com/Unity-Technologies/AutoLOD/issues/71#issuecomment-898980626 https://github.com/Unity-Technologies/AutoLOD/issues/71#issu... : > "UE4 has had automatic LOD generation since it first released - I was honestly baffled when I realized that Unity was missing what I had assumed to be a basic feature.* > Note that Nanite (which I assume you're referring to) is not a LOD system, despite being similar in the basic goal of not rendering as many polygons for distant objects. "Unity: Feature Request: Auto - LOD" (2023-05) https://forum.unity.com/threads/auto-lod.1440610/ https://forum.unity.com/threads/auto-lod.1440610/ "Discussion about Virtualized Geometry (as introduced by UE5)" https://github.com/godotengine/godot-proposals/issues/2793 https://github.com/godotengine/godot-proposals/issues/2793 UE5 Unreal Engine 5 docs > Rendering features > Nanite: https://docs.unrealengine.com/5.0/en-US/RenderingFeatures/Nanite/ https://docs.unrealengine.com/5.0/en-US/RenderingFeatures/Na... Unity-GPU-Based-Occlusion-Culling: https://github.com/przemyslawzaworski/Unity-GPU-Based-Occlusion-Culling/tree/master https://github.com/przemyslawzaworski/Unity-GPU-Based-Occlus...
- westurner 3y ago