3 ms·

> aking effectively twice the space of a small electric car Not that many "small electric cars" out there, Teslas are big, as are the ID.3s and the like coming

> aking effectively twice the space of a small electric car Not that many "small electric cars" out there, Teslas are big, as are the ID.3s and the like coming from Volkswagen. For reference, an ID.3 weights a maximum of almost 2 tons (1935 kg, to be more exact), that's compared to the maximum of 1500 kg for a Golf 7. To say nothing of my 2006 1.4 NA Seat Ibiza weighting just 1054 kg, but which is seen as worst than the devil itself because of its age. So, yeah, I don't buy this crusade against SUVs coming from EV people, seeing as my very lightweight petrol car is also on their chopping block.

isoprophlex 3y ago
Fiat 500e, Nissan Leaf, Renault Zoe, Peugeot 208e, whatever ugly shit Opel/Vauxhall is pushing out...
- paganel 3y ago
  None of those cars (toys) get you very far outside of the city. And inside of the city we've got public transportation.
  - deleted 3y ago
    [deleted]
  - master-lincoln 3y ago
    I'd argue all of the cars you listed get you as far as you have gasoline. Even with room for at least one passenger and luggage. What's your argument? And public transport cannot always replace individual mobility. E.g. transporting big things or sick people is not really an option on public transport
    - yodelshady 3y ago
      If you argue that you'd be a liar. They just don't. They all get about 200 miles real world, my (£10,000 cheaper !) hatchback, petrol with a 55 L tank and much more interior space than any of those, can push 400. Why say things that aren't true? People aren't going to be fooled.
      - fragmede 3y ago
        > can push 400. That is to say, not 400? Why say things that aren't true? People aren't going to be fooled.
        adhesive_wombat 3y ago
        400km on 55l of fuel is pretty low. A car that gets 50mpg (UK gallons), which is fairly middle of the road efficiency, would go 600 miles, or 965km on that, assuming motorway driving. I regularly do 550 miles (850km - 5 return trips of 55 miles each way) on a single 60l tank of diesel in an older car and can do more if I dawdle and cruise more. I know I've been driving badly when the fuel light comes on on before the end of the fifth trip.
        bdavbdav 3y ago
        How come not true? My 3L A6 Quattro did more than 400mls on a tank of you were careful. That’s normal territory for European cars.
    - azherebtsov 3y ago
      My 10 years old diesel on full tank makes 800+ km (tested a few times). None of the EVs can make that nowadays, or they can?
- therealdrag0 3y ago
  The size difference between a Leaf and a RAV4 is negligible.
audunw 3y ago
The issues talked about here are mostly about size (width, length), not weight. Yes, the higher weight of EVs is a bit of an issue. But not as much as people make it out to be. But there are a lot of big EVs now. I think it’s mainly due to all car manufacturers coming out with a new generation of EVs and the first models they make are the ones with the highest margins. I.e. big cars. In the previous generations you had cars like Hyundai Kona EV which is completely reasonable size. But the first in Hyundais new generation is Ioniq 5 which doesn’t look like a monster but is surprisingly big.
- paganel 3y ago
  ID.3s are also big in terms of size, it's just that they're not branded as CUVs/mini-SUVs and that's why they get a pass. For example they're bigger than a Mazda CX-3, which is branded on wikipedia as a "Subcompact crossover SUV (B)".
- _Microft 3y ago
  > Yes, the higher weight of EVs is a bit of an issue. But not as much as people make it out to be. Not to detract from the discussion‘s topic but weight is an issue. Road damage scales with fourth power of axle load. That’s is, a car with 2t instead of 1.5t does three times the damage. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fourth_power_law https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fourth_power_law
  - zemvpferreira 3y ago
    True but that should also tell you that road damage comes almost exclusively from commercial-sized vehicles, coming back to the main point: Added EV weight in passenger cars is a non-issue.
  - OJFord 3y ago
    > Road damage scales with fourth power of axle load. Why? That's not intuitive to me. (I'm not saying you're wrong, just want to understand.)
    - 3y ago

isoprophlex 3y ago

Fiat 500e, Nissan Leaf, Renault Zoe, Peugeot 208e, whatever ugly shit Opel/Vauxhall is pushing out...

paganel 3y ago
None of those cars (toys) get you very far outside of the city. And inside of the city we've got public transportation.
- deleted 3y ago
  [deleted]
- master-lincoln 3y ago
  I'd argue all of the cars you listed get you as far as you have gasoline. Even with room for at least one passenger and luggage. What's your argument? And public transport cannot always replace individual mobility. E.g. transporting big things or sick people is not really an option on public transport
  - yodelshady 3y ago
    If you argue that you'd be a liar. They just don't. They all get about 200 miles real world, my (£10,000 cheaper !) hatchback, petrol with a 55 L tank and much more interior space than any of those, can push 400. Why say things that aren't true? People aren't going to be fooled.
    - fragmede 3y ago
      > can push 400. That is to say, not 400? Why say things that aren't true? People aren't going to be fooled.
      - adhesive_wombat 3y ago
        400km on 55l of fuel is pretty low. A car that gets 50mpg (UK gallons), which is fairly middle of the road efficiency, would go 600 miles, or 965km on that, assuming motorway driving. I regularly do 550 miles (850km - 5 return trips of 55 miles each way) on a single 60l tank of diesel in an older car and can do more if I dawdle and cruise more. I know I've been driving badly when the fuel light comes on on before the end of the fifth trip.
      - bdavbdav 3y ago
        How come not true? My 3L A6 Quattro did more than 400mls on a tank of you were careful. That’s normal territory for European cars.
  - azherebtsov 3y ago
    My 10 years old diesel on full tank makes 800+ km (tested a few times). None of the EVs can make that nowadays, or they can?
therealdrag0 3y ago
The size difference between a Leaf and a RAV4 is negligible.

audunw 3y ago

The issues talked about here are mostly about size (width, length), not weight. Yes, the higher weight of EVs is a bit of an issue. But not as much as people make it out to be. But there are a lot of big EVs now. I think it’s mainly due to all car manufacturers coming out with a new generation of EVs and the first models they make are the ones with the highest margins. I.e. big cars. In the previous generations you had cars like Hyundai Kona EV which is completely reasonable size. But the first in Hyundais new generation is Ioniq 5 which doesn’t look like a monster but is surprisingly big.

paganel 3y ago
ID.3s are also big in terms of size, it's just that they're not branded as CUVs/mini-SUVs and that's why they get a pass. For example they're bigger than a Mazda CX-3, which is branded on wikipedia as a "Subcompact crossover SUV (B)".
_Microft 3y ago
> Yes, the higher weight of EVs is a bit of an issue. But not as much as people make it out to be. Not to detract from the discussion‘s topic but weight is an issue. Road damage scales with fourth power of axle load. That’s is, a car with 2t instead of 1.5t does three times the damage. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fourth_power_law https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fourth_power_law
- zemvpferreira 3y ago
  True but that should also tell you that road damage comes almost exclusively from commercial-sized vehicles, coming back to the main point: Added EV weight in passenger cars is a non-issue.
- OJFord 3y ago
  > Road damage scales with fourth power of axle load. Why? That's not intuitive to me. (I'm not saying you're wrong, just want to understand.)
  - 3y ago