4 ms·

Why does it matter what number is displayed on the clock? Can't you just wake up earlier or later to your preference?

by LeoPanthera 3y ago

Apocryphon 3y ago
Not if they’re working.
- ceejayoz 3y ago
  Or have kids in school.
dryheat3 3y ago
lol. Sure, as long as you don’t have to report to a job everyday. Very few have the privilege of adjusting their sleep/wake cycle to correspond with the changing seasons.
- thsksbd 3y ago
  Well the daylight savings advocates who want to force 10 pm sunsets on everybody can wake up earlier if they wish to have an extra hour of sunlight. For everyone else, no. We cant sleep in for an hour.
  - saithound 3y ago
    That's not how it works. The time when my kids go to school is determined by the current official time, not when I choose to wake up. It's regulated by federal and state laws, and local bylaws. The visitation times at the hospital, court appearances, etc. are all set to the current official time, not when I choose to wake up. It's regulated by federal and state laws, and local bylaws. The airport curfew is determined by the official time, not when I choose to wake up. It's regulated by federal and state laws, and local bylaws. Your point would make sense if everyone had to do only one thing every day, and people existed in small (< Dunbar's number) isolated communities. But we don't: people do multiple things, interact with different communities; all these schedules are interdependent, and many of them set by legislation. Changing all of them is a problem that requires coordination, which is exactly the kind of thing we maintain governments for. The current coordination point is that it's convenient if all these things move one hour forward in the summer, and the mechanism to achieve this is that we change clocks twice a year, instead of the vastly more difficult alternative of maintaining two separate sets of schedules for everything. But it looks like consensus is moving on (again!), and people no longer think that pushing everything forward by one hour in the summer is a good idea (or rather, they think moving it back for the winter is a bad idea). So they'll use the coordination mechanism to make it so.
    - fsckboy 3y ago
      The person you are arguing against and 'splaining to is on the same side of the argument you are. He's turning the other side's argument against them. He's saying "if you think schedules are flexible, flex your schedule"
    - colinsane 3y ago
      of the things you list, the school schedule is the most hard and fast thing. for everything else you mention, you're presented with a window where so long as you can make _some_ time within that window you're fine. is shifting the window an hour in either direction really all that consequential? already there's enough variance in typical day jobs and eating habits that you and i probably differ by an hour and are still able to make it to hospitals, courts, airports, etc. do we adjust school start times today? yes: if you've ever experienced two schools consolidating, or just demographic shifts in the areas being served by a school, it's not uncommon for start times to change. so regardless of how we coordinate at the whole-society level, we'll still do more granular coordination at the workplace, school, and community levels. IMO that outermost layer of coordination really just needs to provide stability, with the more local layers coordinating the finer details. and for many of us, DST is perceived as disrupting that stability: it feels like more of a hindrance to coordination than an aid for it.
    - thsksbd 3y ago
      I know when school starts. Thats not my point. The DST want to force more light onto people when research is pretty clear we need less (although we need more sunlight, ironically) Solution: They wake up an hour earlier, go for a jog, have a cigarette outside, whatever, and then join the rest of society at our regularly scheduled time.
  - stjohnswarts 3y ago
    buy some dark out curtains, they work great and are relatively cheap. My bedroom can be dark as night in the middle of a sunny Texas day.
kerkeslager 3y ago
Some of us have jobs with inflexible hours.
- usr1106 3y ago
  True. And some even have extremely inconvenient hours changing many days a weak. Think of long distance pilots, hospital doctors, and many low paid service jobs. My wife has them and I can see the effects on her health. So I find it ridiculous that every year there are big articles about this one hour twice a year, while other have to damage their health many basically 11 months a year (assuming 4 weeks of consecutive vacation we at least get in here Europe)
  - kerkeslager 3y ago
    Sure, and we should definitely reform those jobs as well. Part of why there's a shortage of medical professionals is due to the insistence on putting them through terrible hours.
  - Eisenstein 3y ago
    I'm not sure that you can make that argument fairly. Shift, on-call, across-time-zones (etc) workers have a job with a recognized hazard which is fully known at the time of acceptance. If your wife did not want to deal with such a schedule then another career should have been chosen, and if she is suffering health effects now then there should be options for disability leave or transfer to a different set of responsibilities. If this is not available I would advocate for it -- but her suffering is not a reason to shift the time scale of the rest of society against their will and to their detriment. Let's do less harm to fewer people and not use some people being harmed to justify doing it to more of them.
IAmGraydon 3y ago
That’s an incredibly out of touch, privileged reply.
CalRobert 3y ago
My kid's school isn't so accommodating.
thih9 3y ago
Correct, most can’t.
herbst 3y ago
It still fucks my mind, my whole time feeling / inner clock gets messed up even thought it doesn't matter how late it is for me, just the knowledge of the current time that doesn't fit my inner calculation is bad, gives me a unwell feeling and feeds into my depression. It makes me feel out of touch with reality if that makes sense. Honestly it was less intensive when I still had a regular job, the fixed daily structures that didn't fit my inner clock anyway kinda masked that issue.

Why does it matter what number is displayed on the clock? Can't you just wake up earlier or later to your preference?

Apocryphon 3y ago

Not if they’re working.

ceejayoz 3y ago
Or have kids in school.

dryheat3 3y ago

lol. Sure, as long as you don’t have to report to a job everyday. Very few have the privilege of adjusting their sleep/wake cycle to correspond with the changing seasons.

thsksbd 3y ago
Well the daylight savings advocates who want to force 10 pm sunsets on everybody can wake up earlier if they wish to have an extra hour of sunlight. For everyone else, no. We cant sleep in for an hour.
- saithound 3y ago
  That's not how it works. The time when my kids go to school is determined by the current official time, not when I choose to wake up. It's regulated by federal and state laws, and local bylaws. The visitation times at the hospital, court appearances, etc. are all set to the current official time, not when I choose to wake up. It's regulated by federal and state laws, and local bylaws. The airport curfew is determined by the official time, not when I choose to wake up. It's regulated by federal and state laws, and local bylaws. Your point would make sense if everyone had to do only one thing every day, and people existed in small (< Dunbar's number) isolated communities. But we don't: people do multiple things, interact with different communities; all these schedules are interdependent, and many of them set by legislation. Changing all of them is a problem that requires coordination, which is exactly the kind of thing we maintain governments for. The current coordination point is that it's convenient if all these things move one hour forward in the summer, and the mechanism to achieve this is that we change clocks twice a year, instead of the vastly more difficult alternative of maintaining two separate sets of schedules for everything. But it looks like consensus is moving on (again!), and people no longer think that pushing everything forward by one hour in the summer is a good idea (or rather, they think moving it back for the winter is a bad idea). So they'll use the coordination mechanism to make it so.
  - fsckboy 3y ago
    The person you are arguing against and 'splaining to is on the same side of the argument you are. He's turning the other side's argument against them. He's saying "if you think schedules are flexible, flex your schedule"
  - colinsane 3y ago
    of the things you list, the school schedule is the most hard and fast thing. for everything else you mention, you're presented with a window where so long as you can make _some_ time within that window you're fine. is shifting the window an hour in either direction really all that consequential? already there's enough variance in typical day jobs and eating habits that you and i probably differ by an hour and are still able to make it to hospitals, courts, airports, etc. do we adjust school start times today? yes: if you've ever experienced two schools consolidating, or just demographic shifts in the areas being served by a school, it's not uncommon for start times to change. so regardless of how we coordinate at the whole-society level, we'll still do more granular coordination at the workplace, school, and community levels. IMO that outermost layer of coordination really just needs to provide stability, with the more local layers coordinating the finer details. and for many of us, DST is perceived as disrupting that stability: it feels like more of a hindrance to coordination than an aid for it.
  - thsksbd 3y ago
    I know when school starts. Thats not my point. The DST want to force more light onto people when research is pretty clear we need less (although we need more sunlight, ironically) Solution: They wake up an hour earlier, go for a jog, have a cigarette outside, whatever, and then join the rest of society at our regularly scheduled time.
- stjohnswarts 3y ago
  buy some dark out curtains, they work great and are relatively cheap. My bedroom can be dark as night in the middle of a sunny Texas day.

kerkeslager 3y ago

Some of us have jobs with inflexible hours.

usr1106 3y ago
True. And some even have extremely inconvenient hours changing many days a weak. Think of long distance pilots, hospital doctors, and many low paid service jobs. My wife has them and I can see the effects on her health. So I find it ridiculous that every year there are big articles about this one hour twice a year, while other have to damage their health many basically 11 months a year (assuming 4 weeks of consecutive vacation we at least get in here Europe)
- kerkeslager 3y ago
  Sure, and we should definitely reform those jobs as well. Part of why there's a shortage of medical professionals is due to the insistence on putting them through terrible hours.
- Eisenstein 3y ago
  I'm not sure that you can make that argument fairly. Shift, on-call, across-time-zones (etc) workers have a job with a recognized hazard which is fully known at the time of acceptance. If your wife did not want to deal with such a schedule then another career should have been chosen, and if she is suffering health effects now then there should be options for disability leave or transfer to a different set of responsibilities. If this is not available I would advocate for it -- but her suffering is not a reason to shift the time scale of the rest of society against their will and to their detriment. Let's do less harm to fewer people and not use some people being harmed to justify doing it to more of them.

IAmGraydon 3y ago

That’s an incredibly out of touch, privileged reply.

CalRobert 3y ago

My kid's school isn't so accommodating.

thih9 3y ago

Correct, most can’t.

herbst 3y ago

It still fucks my mind, my whole time feeling / inner clock gets messed up even thought it doesn't matter how late it is for me, just the knowledge of the current time that doesn't fit my inner calculation is bad, gives me a unwell feeling and feeds into my depression. It makes me feel out of touch with reality if that makes sense. Honestly it was less intensive when I still had a regular job, the fixed daily structures that didn't fit my inner clock anyway kinda masked that issue.