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Most people lack subject matter expertise on topics they espouse opinions impertinently, don't look at the evidence, and don't take sensible precautions against

Most people lack subject matter expertise on topics they espouse opinions impertinently, don't look at the evidence, and don't take sensible precautions against unknowns, so their opinions don't matter. In the absence of compelling precautionary evidence and systematic safety processes, it's clear that the faithful adherents of organic production are more likely to be safer than industrial megafarming done with the same blind faith in the miracles of chemical wizardry that brought us such hits as organophosphates, chlorpyrifos, DDT, and the over 85k compounds that are de facto unregulated because they are allowed until specific injury is proven after the damage is done ("whack-a-mole"-style), rather than first proven safe.

hinkley 3y ago
At work we have a term for the people who completely dismiss the opinions of laypeople who have to use what they produce. We call them assholes. Or fucking assholes, depending on the degree.
gruez 3y ago
>the faithful adherents of organic production are more likely to be safer than industrial megafarming But the "organic" label doesn't check whether the farmers were "faithful adherents of organic production", only that they fulfilled the organic checklist. They can use as much chemical fertilizer and pesticides as they want, so long they're on the approved list. In the same vain farming and "industrial megafarming" isn't mutually exclusive.
- mikeiz404 3y ago
  That list appears to be relatively restrictive: - Bacillus subtilis - Bacilus thuringiensis - Beauveria bassiana - Boric acid: Structural pest control, no direct contact with organic food or crops. - Coniothyrium minitans - Copper: Copper hydroxide, copper oxide, copper oxychloride, includes products exempted from EPA tolerance, provided that copper-based materials must be used in a manner that minimizes accumulation in the soil and shall not be used as herbicides. - Copper sulfate: Application rates are limited to levels which do not increase baseline soil test values for copper over a timeframe agreed upon by the producer and accredited certifying agent. - Corn gluten - Cydia pomonella granulosis - Diatomaceous earth - Gibberellic acid - Horticultural vinegar - Hydrogen peroxide - Lime sulfer: Including calcium polysulfide - Minerals such as elemental sulfur, bicarbonate, or kaolin clay - Myrothecium verrucaria - Non-detergent insecticidal soaps: As a pesticide, fungicide, or algaecide for food crops - Oils, including petroleum, vegetable, and fish oils: Types include dormant, suffocating, and summer oils - Peracetic acid: For use to control fire blight bacteria. Also permitted in hydrogen peroxide formulations at a concentration of no more than 6% as indicated on the pesticide product label - Pheromones and pheromone traps - Plant-derived substances such as neem, caraway oil, seed fennel, quassia, or ryania - Ryania/Ryanodine - Sabadilla - Spinosad - Streptomycin sulfate and tetracycline - Sticky traps - Vitamin D3: As a rodencide https://www.agdaily.com/technology/the-list-of-pesticides-approved-for-organic-production/ https://www.agdaily.com/technology/the-list-of-pesticides-ap... See also https://www.ecfr.gov/current/title-7/subtitle-B/chapter-I/subchapter-M/part-205/subpart-G https://www.ecfr.gov/current/title-7/subtitle-B/chapter-I/su... And the farms are re-certified annually to be in compliance. To maintain organic certification, your certified organic farm or business will go through an annual review and inspection process. https://www.ams.usda.gov/services/organic-certification/becoming-certified https://www.ams.usda.gov/services/organic-certification/beco... - More than 45,000 onsite inspections per year by certifying agents to monitor compliance with USDA organic standards. Every certified operation has at least one onsite inspection each year. - Certifiers audited by USDA to make sure they are implementing the rules correctly. - Residue testing program to verify that prohibited pesticides aren’t being applied to organic crops. - Robust compliance and enforcement activities. - Risk-based investigations based on operation size, complexity, geographic location or compliance history. https://www.ams.usda.gov/services/organic-certification/organic-basics https://www.ams.usda.gov/services/organic-certification/orga...

hinkley 3y ago

At work we have a term for the people who completely dismiss the opinions of laypeople who have to use what they produce. We call them assholes. Or fucking assholes, depending on the degree.

gruez 3y ago

>the faithful adherents of organic production are more likely to be safer than industrial megafarming But the "organic" label doesn't check whether the farmers were "faithful adherents of organic production", only that they fulfilled the organic checklist. They can use as much chemical fertilizer and pesticides as they want, so long they're on the approved list. In the same vain farming and "industrial megafarming" isn't mutually exclusive.

mikeiz404 3y ago
That list appears to be relatively restrictive: - Bacillus subtilis - Bacilus thuringiensis - Beauveria bassiana - Boric acid: Structural pest control, no direct contact with organic food or crops. - Coniothyrium minitans - Copper: Copper hydroxide, copper oxide, copper oxychloride, includes products exempted from EPA tolerance, provided that copper-based materials must be used in a manner that minimizes accumulation in the soil and shall not be used as herbicides. - Copper sulfate: Application rates are limited to levels which do not increase baseline soil test values for copper over a timeframe agreed upon by the producer and accredited certifying agent. - Corn gluten - Cydia pomonella granulosis - Diatomaceous earth - Gibberellic acid - Horticultural vinegar - Hydrogen peroxide - Lime sulfer: Including calcium polysulfide - Minerals such as elemental sulfur, bicarbonate, or kaolin clay - Myrothecium verrucaria - Non-detergent insecticidal soaps: As a pesticide, fungicide, or algaecide for food crops - Oils, including petroleum, vegetable, and fish oils: Types include dormant, suffocating, and summer oils - Peracetic acid: For use to control fire blight bacteria. Also permitted in hydrogen peroxide formulations at a concentration of no more than 6% as indicated on the pesticide product label - Pheromones and pheromone traps - Plant-derived substances such as neem, caraway oil, seed fennel, quassia, or ryania - Ryania/Ryanodine - Sabadilla - Spinosad - Streptomycin sulfate and tetracycline - Sticky traps - Vitamin D3: As a rodencide https://www.agdaily.com/technology/the-list-of-pesticides-approved-for-organic-production/ https://www.agdaily.com/technology/the-list-of-pesticides-ap... See also https://www.ecfr.gov/current/title-7/subtitle-B/chapter-I/subchapter-M/part-205/subpart-G https://www.ecfr.gov/current/title-7/subtitle-B/chapter-I/su... And the farms are re-certified annually to be in compliance. To maintain organic certification, your certified organic farm or business will go through an annual review and inspection process. https://www.ams.usda.gov/services/organic-certification/becoming-certified https://www.ams.usda.gov/services/organic-certification/beco... - More than 45,000 onsite inspections per year by certifying agents to monitor compliance with USDA organic standards. Every certified operation has at least one onsite inspection each year. - Certifiers audited by USDA to make sure they are implementing the rules correctly. - Residue testing program to verify that prohibited pesticides aren’t being applied to organic crops. - Robust compliance and enforcement activities. - Risk-based investigations based on operation size, complexity, geographic location or compliance history. https://www.ams.usda.gov/services/organic-certification/organic-basics https://www.ams.usda.gov/services/organic-certification/orga...