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I always find that those who follow this effective altruism thing are very big on abstract thought. It is accepted that philantropy is not 100% altruistic, lea

I always find that those who follow this effective altruism thing are very big on abstract thought. It is accepted that philantropy is not 100% altruistic, leave it alone the tax deductions and tax shelter schemes but as a practice it's done to virtue signal or to feel like we are doing something meaningful or that we are changing people's lives. Effective altruists find pleasure in the numbers turning around on a big scale and being celebrated as a philantropist, perhaps the Nobel Peace Prize? All stuff that would stimulate an abstract mind. The opposite of an abstract mind is a mind that is in deep connection with the body and the 5 senses such mind knows that there is no way you can hug and see the change upon the faces many millions of people, whereas if you do good now you can hug the person you are helping right now and you can also see the change upon their faces instantly and you can appreciate it as opposed to seeing them as a number 30 years down the road.

krisoft 3y ago
> I always find that those who follow this effective altruism thing are very big on abstract thought. That is probably true. > The opposite of an abstract mind is a mind that is in deep connection with the body and the 5 senses such mind knows that there is no way you can hug and see the change upon the faces many millions of people Ok? And turns out what feels right to do and what is right to do is not always the same thing. Imagine you are living in a medieval city ravaged by waterborne diseases. You can spend your time running around nursing the sick, cooking them soup, hoping that they recover. Or you can use the same energy to design a water treatment plant / sewer / aquaduct and prevent the spread of the disease in the first place. One feels good, you are helping humans in their hour of need. Some die, but spend their last days in a bit more comfort due to your ministrations. Some recover. Hopefully more than would have recovered without your nursing. The other is literal shit pumping. It does not feel good at all. And yet, we know that sanitary infrastructure is the key to the health of a city. You can cure max like a few hundred per week by nursing. But with a water treatment plant you can prevent illness in millions and millions. Will you able to hug them and see change upon the face of them? No, probably they won't even know who you are, or that you helped them not being sick.
- JumpinJack_Cash 3y ago
  > > You can spend your time running around nursing the sick, cooking them soup, hoping that they recover. Or you can use the same energy to design a water treatment plant / sewer / aquaduct and prevent the spread of the disease in the first place. I believe you need both the first responders and those who plan for the wider state of the emergency. What I mean is that the so called effective altruists are a minority who cannot extract satisfaction from the work of first responders but want to have the same glory and recognition as they do, but given that it's not something spontaneous from those who are being helped (as they show gratitude to the first responders not the head of Foundation) they have to go to great lenghts to create these publicity and propaganda fueled philosophical currents, effective altruism being one of them. It's not something new it's been around for a long time before effective altruism emerged, and specifically in the form of prizes such as Key of the city for philantropic work Philantropist of the year Biggest philantropic donation of the year Nobel Peace Prize etc etc
  - krisoft 3y ago
    You have a very dark view of effective alturist. I know a few people who describe themselves as such and none of them are this twisted “cannot extract satisfaction from the work of first responders but want to have the same glory and recognition as they do” person. They are just regular people with analytical minds. They would like good things to happen and they also recognise that resources are finite thus they ask how it is best to spend the finite resources to achieve the best bang for the buck. That is basically the only comonality among them. Whatever machiavellian machinations you subscribe to them doesn’t seem to match my preceived reality.
    - JumpinJack_Cash 3y ago
      > > I know a few people who describe themselves as such and none of them are this twisted “cannot extract satisfaction from the work of first responders but want to have the same glory and recognition as they do” But if you read my comment what I said is not just limited to effective altruism which is the new kid on the block , I have a similar feelings for all the other stuff that I mentioned including the Nobel Peace Prize. It's like sports, nobody cheers for the owner of the franchise or gets excited about meeting them or the General Manager, it's all about the players. That's the reason why certain owners and General Managers do lots of media and outreach to propagate their cult and get some love from the fanbase.
styxfrix 3y ago
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krisoft 3y ago

> I always find that those who follow this effective altruism thing are very big on abstract thought. That is probably true. > The opposite of an abstract mind is a mind that is in deep connection with the body and the 5 senses such mind knows that there is no way you can hug and see the change upon the faces many millions of people Ok? And turns out what feels right to do and what is right to do is not always the same thing. Imagine you are living in a medieval city ravaged by waterborne diseases. You can spend your time running around nursing the sick, cooking them soup, hoping that they recover. Or you can use the same energy to design a water treatment plant / sewer / aquaduct and prevent the spread of the disease in the first place. One feels good, you are helping humans in their hour of need. Some die, but spend their last days in a bit more comfort due to your ministrations. Some recover. Hopefully more than would have recovered without your nursing. The other is literal shit pumping. It does not feel good at all. And yet, we know that sanitary infrastructure is the key to the health of a city. You can cure max like a few hundred per week by nursing. But with a water treatment plant you can prevent illness in millions and millions. Will you able to hug them and see change upon the face of them? No, probably they won't even know who you are, or that you helped them not being sick.

JumpinJack_Cash 3y ago
> > You can spend your time running around nursing the sick, cooking them soup, hoping that they recover. Or you can use the same energy to design a water treatment plant / sewer / aquaduct and prevent the spread of the disease in the first place. I believe you need both the first responders and those who plan for the wider state of the emergency. What I mean is that the so called effective altruists are a minority who cannot extract satisfaction from the work of first responders but want to have the same glory and recognition as they do, but given that it's not something spontaneous from those who are being helped (as they show gratitude to the first responders not the head of Foundation) they have to go to great lenghts to create these publicity and propaganda fueled philosophical currents, effective altruism being one of them. It's not something new it's been around for a long time before effective altruism emerged, and specifically in the form of prizes such as Key of the city for philantropic work Philantropist of the year Biggest philantropic donation of the year Nobel Peace Prize etc etc
- krisoft 3y ago
  You have a very dark view of effective alturist. I know a few people who describe themselves as such and none of them are this twisted “cannot extract satisfaction from the work of first responders but want to have the same glory and recognition as they do” person. They are just regular people with analytical minds. They would like good things to happen and they also recognise that resources are finite thus they ask how it is best to spend the finite resources to achieve the best bang for the buck. That is basically the only comonality among them. Whatever machiavellian machinations you subscribe to them doesn’t seem to match my preceived reality.
  - JumpinJack_Cash 3y ago
    > > I know a few people who describe themselves as such and none of them are this twisted “cannot extract satisfaction from the work of first responders but want to have the same glory and recognition as they do” But if you read my comment what I said is not just limited to effective altruism which is the new kid on the block , I have a similar feelings for all the other stuff that I mentioned including the Nobel Peace Prize. It's like sports, nobody cheers for the owner of the franchise or gets excited about meeting them or the General Manager, it's all about the players. That's the reason why certain owners and General Managers do lots of media and outreach to propagate their cult and get some love from the fanbase.

styxfrix 3y ago

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