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> In over 35 years of owning many many cars, the number of times I've had an ICE internal component go bad is.. zero. Statistical noise aside, that's not a thin

> In over 35 years of owning many many cars, the number of times I've had an ICE internal component go bad is.. zero. Statistical noise aside, that's not a thing anymore and has not been since the 60s/70s. If ICE cars never fail, I wonder what all the auto mechanics are doing? 282,637 automotive repair companies are currently in business, with 614,433 employees. How are they surviving is nobody is getting their ICE cars repaired? I've had interactions with a few hundred people (at least) over 2 decades and every single person had their ICE car in the shop for repairs, small and large. ICE cars also have major scheduled maintenance, somewhere around 90 - 120K, you have to replace timing belt and a bunch of things. Car dealers don't make any money on selling new cars. Nobody buys a new car unless its priced a few thousand below MSRP (the past 2 years are an aberration). Dealerships make money on service. This is the same model as inkjet printers. ICE cars are so horribly unreliable and bad, even new ones, there exist special laws just for them: lemon laws.

AlexandrB 3y ago
> ICE cars are so horribly unreliable and bad, even new ones, there exist special laws just for them: lemon laws. Cars in general are complex and expensive, Tesla EVs run afoul of lemon laws all the time: https://insideevs.com/news/433383/tesla-warranty-repairs-goodwill-lemon-laundering/ https://insideevs.com/news/433383/tesla-warranty-repairs-goo... > 282,637 automotive repair companies are currently in business, with 614,433 employees. How are they surviving is nobody is getting their ICE cars repaired? Collisions. The most expensive repair I've had is bodywork after a small fender bender. Way more expensive than maintenance or even pretty substantial repairs like an alternator replacement. That's not to say that ICE cars don't ever need repairs for mechanical failures, but for such a complex machine they're extremely reliable.
jjav 3y ago
> If ICE cars never fail Well I never said that. I said that components of the IC engine itself fail exceedingly rarely (in my personal experience, never). "The car" is a far greater system than just the engine or motor. The powerplant (IC or electric) is a tiny percentage of the car as a whole. It's all the other stuff that fails and keeps cars in the repair shop. My second EV spent multiple weeks at the dealer to fix a window regulator that kept failing. Other things that often fail are electronics, actuator motors, wiring glitches, shocks, etc. All parts which are common to all cars, regardless of how it happens to produce horsepower. > ICE cars are so horribly unreliable and bad, even new ones, there exist special laws just for them: lemon laws. Ok you're clearly biased, since the above is not true. Lemon laws are not specific to ICE cars. They apply to EVs and plenty of EVs get repurchased due to lemon law criteria. I personally know someone who lemon law'd a Tesla. Lemons laws trigger if a new car spends an inordinate time at the dealer being repaired for whatever reason. Our EV (with the window regulator problem) came within a week of meeting lemon law criteria.

AlexandrB 3y ago

> ICE cars are so horribly unreliable and bad, even new ones, there exist special laws just for them: lemon laws. Cars in general are complex and expensive, Tesla EVs run afoul of lemon laws all the time: https://insideevs.com/news/433383/tesla-warranty-repairs-goodwill-lemon-laundering/ https://insideevs.com/news/433383/tesla-warranty-repairs-goo... > 282,637 automotive repair companies are currently in business, with 614,433 employees. How are they surviving is nobody is getting their ICE cars repaired? Collisions. The most expensive repair I've had is bodywork after a small fender bender. Way more expensive than maintenance or even pretty substantial repairs like an alternator replacement. That's not to say that ICE cars don't ever need repairs for mechanical failures, but for such a complex machine they're extremely reliable.

jjav 3y ago

> If ICE cars never fail Well I never said that. I said that components of the IC engine itself fail exceedingly rarely (in my personal experience, never). "The car" is a far greater system than just the engine or motor. The powerplant (IC or electric) is a tiny percentage of the car as a whole. It's all the other stuff that fails and keeps cars in the repair shop. My second EV spent multiple weeks at the dealer to fix a window regulator that kept failing. Other things that often fail are electronics, actuator motors, wiring glitches, shocks, etc. All parts which are common to all cars, regardless of how it happens to produce horsepower. > ICE cars are so horribly unreliable and bad, even new ones, there exist special laws just for them: lemon laws. Ok you're clearly biased, since the above is not true. Lemon laws are not specific to ICE cars. They apply to EVs and plenty of EVs get repurchased due to lemon law criteria. I personally know someone who lemon law'd a Tesla. Lemons laws trigger if a new car spends an inordinate time at the dealer being repaired for whatever reason. Our EV (with the window regulator problem) came within a week of meeting lemon law criteria.