4 ms·

So what's his term in jail?

by xezzed 3y ago

CSMastermind 3y ago
We don't know yet, sentencing is separate from the trial that determines innocence or guilt. Now there will be another hearing in March during which the judge will consider all of the evidence (even that which wasn't allowed in the original trial) to determine what his punishment should be. The judge will have to abide by the federal sentencing guidelines which specify the punishments and severity they can apply but otherwise it's a matter of their discretion.
- tptacek 3y ago
  The judge will not in fact have to abide by the guidelines, which are advisory, and are especially advisory in sui generis trials like this where the damages and victim counts blow out the guideline charts.
  - dragonwriter 3y ago
    Damages blowing out the charts just means a very high guidelines offense level, it doesn't make the guidelines any less applicable (and there's not really charts for victim numbers, there's a few categories for financial offenses, but mainly the guidelines expect beyond a few the aggregate loss factor to handle it, and by the time you blow the top off that chart, you've also very nearly (with just that factor and the base offense level) maxed out to a sentence of life or whatever the maximum is for the offenses on which you were convicted -- it only takes a few additional modifiers like having a substantial portion of the criminal conduct outside of the US to do that. Way too many people here have read Popehat's (very important!) piece about how reporting of aggregate statutory maximum penalties is usually extremely misleading because in the vast majority of cases the guidelines ranges (1) will be applied, and (2) will be much shorter than the aggregate statutory maximum and are hypercorrecting into "SBF's actual sentence will be far below the aggregate statutory maximum because sentencing guidelines", without any idea of how the guidelines would apply to the facts at issue in the case.
    - tptacek 3y ago
      For what it's worth, this is an argument I shoplifted from Andrew McCarthy in TNR.
  - Ekaros 3y ago
    It is sad there isn't some easy linear calculation like divide the amount defrauded by minimum wage and sentence is that number divided by 8 in days. It is always sad when people get discounts just because they stole lot of money compared to some that stole little...
    - akerl_ 3y ago
      By the federal guidelines, the base sentence for somebody who stole more than 10mm and defrauded more than 500 people is life. There’s no discounts here. What seems more likely to me is that life will end up excluded by a statutory maximum, and the judge will exceed the guideline dollar figure based on the degree to which SBF’s crimes exceed the guideline scale.
- dragonwriter 3y ago
  > The judge will have to abide by the federal sentencing guidelines The judge will probably adhere to the sentencing guidelines (and will almost certainly use them as a starting point if not), but the guidelines are, like the Pirate Code, "more what you'd call guidelines than actual rules". The Supreme Court has ruled that the judges are constitutionally empowered to depart in either direction from the guidelines sentences within the statutory minimum and maximum for the offenses on which the offender is convicted.
upupupandaway 3y ago
Let's just say he'll have a lot of time to play LoL

So what's his term in jail?

by xezzed 3y ago

So what's his term in jail?

We don't know yet, sentencing is separate from the trial that determines innocence or guilt. Now there will be another hearing in March during which the judge will consider all of the evidence (even that which wasn't allowed in the original trial) to determine what his punishment should be. The judge will have to abide by the federal sentencing guidelines which specify the punishments and severity they can apply but otherwise it's a matter of their discretion.

tptacek 3y ago
The judge will not in fact have to abide by the guidelines, which are advisory, and are especially advisory in sui generis trials like this where the damages and victim counts blow out the guideline charts.
- dragonwriter 3y ago
  Damages blowing out the charts just means a very high guidelines offense level, it doesn't make the guidelines any less applicable (and there's not really charts for victim numbers, there's a few categories for financial offenses, but mainly the guidelines expect beyond a few the aggregate loss factor to handle it, and by the time you blow the top off that chart, you've also very nearly (with just that factor and the base offense level) maxed out to a sentence of life or whatever the maximum is for the offenses on which you were convicted -- it only takes a few additional modifiers like having a substantial portion of the criminal conduct outside of the US to do that. Way too many people here have read Popehat's (very important!) piece about how reporting of aggregate statutory maximum penalties is usually extremely misleading because in the vast majority of cases the guidelines ranges (1) will be applied, and (2) will be much shorter than the aggregate statutory maximum and are hypercorrecting into "SBF's actual sentence will be far below the aggregate statutory maximum because sentencing guidelines", without any idea of how the guidelines would apply to the facts at issue in the case.
  - tptacek 3y ago
    For what it's worth, this is an argument I shoplifted from Andrew McCarthy in TNR.
- Ekaros 3y ago
  It is sad there isn't some easy linear calculation like divide the amount defrauded by minimum wage and sentence is that number divided by 8 in days. It is always sad when people get discounts just because they stole lot of money compared to some that stole little...
  - akerl_ 3y ago
    By the federal guidelines, the base sentence for somebody who stole more than 10mm and defrauded more than 500 people is life. There’s no discounts here. What seems more likely to me is that life will end up excluded by a statutory maximum, and the judge will exceed the guideline dollar figure based on the degree to which SBF’s crimes exceed the guideline scale.
dragonwriter 3y ago
> The judge will have to abide by the federal sentencing guidelines The judge will probably adhere to the sentencing guidelines (and will almost certainly use them as a starting point if not), but the guidelines are, like the Pirate Code, "more what you'd call guidelines than actual rules". The Supreme Court has ruled that the judges are constitutionally empowered to depart in either direction from the guidelines sentences within the statutory minimum and maximum for the offenses on which the offender is convicted.

upupupandaway 3y ago

Let's just say he'll have a lot of time to play LoL