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> HAVANA, Nov 2 (Reuters) - The U.N. General Assembly called for the 31st time on the United States to end its decades-long trade embargo against Cuba as the co

> HAVANA, Nov 2 (Reuters) - The U.N. General Assembly called for the 31st time on the United States to end its decades-long trade embargo against Cuba as the communist-run island suffers its worst economic crisis in decades, with shortages of food, fuel and medicine. So for the 31st time they've asked the US to end the embargo again, that's a little less newsworthy.

justrealist 3y ago
The US embargo is not effective or a good idea, but there are a lot of countries perfectly free to trade with Cuba, the UN noise here is really pretty goofy. With the exception of maybe medicine (not that the US is known for low-price drugs) these are all highly fungible goods and direct trade with the US has no impact on their availability in Cuba.
- ianferrel 3y ago
  >direct trade with the US has no impact on their availability in Cuba. This is factually very wrong. The US uses a variety of methods to enforce the embargo, including sanctions on multinational corporations that provide goods to Cuba and pressure on other governments that the US provides funds or support to in other contexts (which is a lot of countries). It's not nearly as simple as "oh, Cuba can just buy the goods from other countries". Better hope that none of those goods are made by a company that has any legal presence in the US. Also there are like 6 decades worth of laws involved here, so before you think about selling goods to Cuba, better hire a dozen very expensive lawyers.
  - wolverine876 3y ago
    Also, the US is by far the largest producer and buyer of goods in the region, as well as by far the largest source of finance and services. It would be difficult to have a successful economy without trading with the US.
    - Jensson 3y ago
      > the largest source of finance Cuba being communist doesn't allow outside investments and they don't have any problems getting regular loans, so US financing wouldn't help their economy much at all.
      - wolverine876 3y ago
        What is that based on? Who doesn't have problems getting loans? Everyone in Cuba?
        Jensson 3y ago
        The government of Cuba doesn't have problems getting loans. For private citizens the biggest obstacle for them getting loans is the Cuban government not liking private enterprises or ownership, not the embargo. Cuba is moving towards a capitalist economy so it isn't that bad today though.
        wolverine876 3y ago
        Again, what is that based on? Also, you said the Cuban government doesn't allow outside investments - where did you learn that?
        Jensson 3y ago
        > Again, what is that based on? They run a trade deficit of billions each year. How can they import goods for billions without being able to take on debt? Their debt is also increasing by billions per year. They wouldn't be able to do that if they couldn't get loans. > you said the Cuban government doesn't allow outside investments - where did you learn that? I based it on this from the wikipedia page: "In February 2016, the US government allowed two American men from Alabama to build a factory that will assemble as many as 1,000 small tractors a year for sale to private farmers in Cuba. The $5 million to $10 million plant would be the first significant US business investment on Cuban soil since 1959.[55][56] The deal was not authorized by Cuban authorities later that year because one of the owners had recently obtained Cuban citizenship. Factory ownership is still illegal in Cuba.[57]" I see now that I was mistaken. The problem was that Cuba doesn't allow their citizens to own means of production, foreign investors owning stuff is somehow more okay. Their legal landscape from foreign investors is still in the works though, not many wants to invest there when Cuba can just take whatever they built there at any point. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_embargo_against_Cuba#:~:text=The%20United%20States%20embargo%20against,trade%20embargo%20in%20modern%20history https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_embargo_against_....

justrealist 3y ago

The US embargo is not effective or a good idea, but there are a lot of countries perfectly free to trade with Cuba, the UN noise here is really pretty goofy. With the exception of maybe medicine (not that the US is known for low-price drugs) these are all highly fungible goods and direct trade with the US has no impact on their availability in Cuba.

ianferrel 3y ago
>direct trade with the US has no impact on their availability in Cuba. This is factually very wrong. The US uses a variety of methods to enforce the embargo, including sanctions on multinational corporations that provide goods to Cuba and pressure on other governments that the US provides funds or support to in other contexts (which is a lot of countries). It's not nearly as simple as "oh, Cuba can just buy the goods from other countries". Better hope that none of those goods are made by a company that has any legal presence in the US. Also there are like 6 decades worth of laws involved here, so before you think about selling goods to Cuba, better hire a dozen very expensive lawyers.
- wolverine876 3y ago
  Also, the US is by far the largest producer and buyer of goods in the region, as well as by far the largest source of finance and services. It would be difficult to have a successful economy without trading with the US.
  - Jensson 3y ago
    > the largest source of finance Cuba being communist doesn't allow outside investments and they don't have any problems getting regular loans, so US financing wouldn't help their economy much at all.
    - wolverine876 3y ago
      What is that based on? Who doesn't have problems getting loans? Everyone in Cuba?
      - Jensson 3y ago
        The government of Cuba doesn't have problems getting loans. For private citizens the biggest obstacle for them getting loans is the Cuban government not liking private enterprises or ownership, not the embargo. Cuba is moving towards a capitalist economy so it isn't that bad today though.
        wolverine876 3y ago
        Again, what is that based on? Also, you said the Cuban government doesn't allow outside investments - where did you learn that?
        Jensson 3y ago
        > Again, what is that based on? They run a trade deficit of billions each year. How can they import goods for billions without being able to take on debt? Their debt is also increasing by billions per year. They wouldn't be able to do that if they couldn't get loans. > you said the Cuban government doesn't allow outside investments - where did you learn that? I based it on this from the wikipedia page: "In February 2016, the US government allowed two American men from Alabama to build a factory that will assemble as many as 1,000 small tractors a year for sale to private farmers in Cuba. The $5 million to $10 million plant would be the first significant US business investment on Cuban soil since 1959.[55][56] The deal was not authorized by Cuban authorities later that year because one of the owners had recently obtained Cuban citizenship. Factory ownership is still illegal in Cuba.[57]" I see now that I was mistaken. The problem was that Cuba doesn't allow their citizens to own means of production, foreign investors owning stuff is somehow more okay. Their legal landscape from foreign investors is still in the works though, not many wants to invest there when Cuba can just take whatever they built there at any point. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_embargo_against_Cuba#:~:text=The%20United%20States%20embargo%20against,trade%20embargo%20in%20modern%20history https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_embargo_against_....