4 ms·

I don't know where all the frustration with HA is coming from. I've only started with it last year and so far the experience is amazing. Not only that everythin

by yoavm 3y ago

I don't know where all the frustration with HA is coming from. I've only started with it last year and so far the experience is amazing. Not only that everything just works with it, it's also so simple to create fun automations, and recently I've even built a little watering system with a Pi Pico, and integrating it with HA to show graphs and controls was a breeze. Also, literally can't recall one time I had to update a config when upgrading HA. It's the one piece of software I'm never worried when pressing "update".

Heliosmaster 3y ago
I've only recently (less than a month ago) started to use HA and I have polar opposite impression from you. I gave up on updating because the 2 times i updated the HA Core package and the OS most of my integrations broke. The first time i bothered changing the config. The second time I decided to rollback and keep everything as is.
- oakesm9 3y ago
  Maybe the issue is that you used the "Core" installation method which isn't a fully managed installation and only really there for "advanced" use cases. It has this warning above the installation steps: > This is an advanced installation process, and some steps might differ on your system. Considering the nature of this installation type, we assume you can handle subtle differences between this document and the system configuration you are using. When in doubt, please consider one of the other installation methods, as they might be a better fit instead. I use the container installation method and it's usually as simple as updating the version number in Docker Compose and restarting. I'd imagine the full OS image is even easier and more stable.
  - Heliosmaster 3y ago
    I use what they recommend: I installed Home Assistant Operating System on a Raspberry PI 3. Which still means there's an OS and there's HA Core. > Home Assistant Operating System: Minimal Operating System optimized to power Home Assistant. It comes with Supervisor to manage Home Assistant Core and Add-ons. Recommended installation method. I tried on purpose to do everything as 'basic' as possible because I don't want to spend time making sure it keeps working.
    - baq 3y ago
      no idea why it's recommended to install manually; I'd recommend docker every time. currently running on docker and upgrading was indeed just pulling new images (didn't even have to tweak the compose file, just docker compose pull). There's been a few helpful UI messages about outdated integrations in the config (e.g. workday detection moved to UI config, used to be yaml).
      - nijave 3y ago
        Iirc Home Assistant Operating System does use Docker. It's a bare bones Linux distro built with buildroot that basically just runs Docker containers
      - Heliosmaster 3y ago
        I don't think the problem is how to update: it's easy enough in the interface, it just works. The problem is whether after the upgrade you suddenly don't see the heater anymore, or another device stops working.
    - oakesm9 3y ago
      Ah ok, I misunderstood then. I presumed if you used the OS installation method then the upgrade was done from within the web UI, but I maybe have misunderstood that too.
      - Heliosmaster 3y ago
        yep, through the UI. the update went fine, the system afterwards didn't work properly though.. :(
  - Izkata 3y ago
    > I'd imagine the full OS image is even easier and more stable. It notifies you when there's an upgrade, you just click "Install" in the GUI. That said, every time I update it the disk image grows by like a full gig. Haven't figured out where that's going so I just don't update it anymore. It's running on a minimal headless computer and doesn't have enough space to keep doing that.
- yoavm 3y ago
  Yeah like others suggested, maybe it has to do with the installation method. I'm using a Home Assistant Blue. It all came configured, I'm clicking "update" a couple of times a month and never had the slightest issue.
- nijave 3y ago
  I think it really depends on when you entered the ecosystem and the maturity of the integrations you're using. HA has some contribution standards but you can get plenty of "I made this in my freentime and upstreamed it" integrations that end up going through major renovations. Sometimes vendors take notice and also weigh in. Additionally, if you got in ~5 years ago when it was pure yaml, it seems a couple times a year there's breaking changes where more yaml is ripped out and manual reconfig is necessary (it'd be nice if it just migrated the config for you)
PurpleRamen 3y ago
> I don't know where all the frustration with HA is coming from Because it's breaking all the time. They have a big surface, and integrations are changing fast, this is natural. But at the same time they are also eager to change and break things on their own software, and this all accumulates to a messy experience for many people.
- billfor 3y ago
  It’s not natural. I use both hA and Openhab with about 20 integrations/addons and HA breaks more (hello zwave}. Openhab almost never breaks on an addon level. If it breaks at all it’s in the core and patched quickly.
  - throitallaway 3y ago
    How HA has handled ZWave is my only complaint with HA.
mongol 3y ago
If you only had it for a year, you may not have seen it yet. I had lots of configs setup, then I did not have it running for a year or so. Trying to make it run again on the latest version was frustrating. I want to set up and forget to the largest extent possible.

by yoavm 3y ago

Heliosmaster 3y ago

I've only recently (less than a month ago) started to use HA and I have polar opposite impression from you. I gave up on updating because the 2 times i updated the HA Core package and the OS most of my integrations broke. The first time i bothered changing the config. The second time I decided to rollback and keep everything as is.

oakesm9 3y ago
Maybe the issue is that you used the "Core" installation method which isn't a fully managed installation and only really there for "advanced" use cases. It has this warning above the installation steps: > This is an advanced installation process, and some steps might differ on your system. Considering the nature of this installation type, we assume you can handle subtle differences between this document and the system configuration you are using. When in doubt, please consider one of the other installation methods, as they might be a better fit instead. I use the container installation method and it's usually as simple as updating the version number in Docker Compose and restarting. I'd imagine the full OS image is even easier and more stable.
- Heliosmaster 3y ago
  I use what they recommend: I installed Home Assistant Operating System on a Raspberry PI 3. Which still means there's an OS and there's HA Core. > Home Assistant Operating System: Minimal Operating System optimized to power Home Assistant. It comes with Supervisor to manage Home Assistant Core and Add-ons. Recommended installation method. I tried on purpose to do everything as 'basic' as possible because I don't want to spend time making sure it keeps working.
  - baq 3y ago
    no idea why it's recommended to install manually; I'd recommend docker every time. currently running on docker and upgrading was indeed just pulling new images (didn't even have to tweak the compose file, just docker compose pull). There's been a few helpful UI messages about outdated integrations in the config (e.g. workday detection moved to UI config, used to be yaml).
    - nijave 3y ago
      Iirc Home Assistant Operating System does use Docker. It's a bare bones Linux distro built with buildroot that basically just runs Docker containers
    - Heliosmaster 3y ago
      I don't think the problem is how to update: it's easy enough in the interface, it just works. The problem is whether after the upgrade you suddenly don't see the heater anymore, or another device stops working.
  - oakesm9 3y ago
    Ah ok, I misunderstood then. I presumed if you used the OS installation method then the upgrade was done from within the web UI, but I maybe have misunderstood that too.
    - Heliosmaster 3y ago
      yep, through the UI. the update went fine, the system afterwards didn't work properly though.. :(
- Izkata 3y ago
  > I'd imagine the full OS image is even easier and more stable. It notifies you when there's an upgrade, you just click "Install" in the GUI. That said, every time I update it the disk image grows by like a full gig. Haven't figured out where that's going so I just don't update it anymore. It's running on a minimal headless computer and doesn't have enough space to keep doing that.
yoavm 3y ago
Yeah like others suggested, maybe it has to do with the installation method. I'm using a Home Assistant Blue. It all came configured, I'm clicking "update" a couple of times a month and never had the slightest issue.
nijave 3y ago
I think it really depends on when you entered the ecosystem and the maturity of the integrations you're using. HA has some contribution standards but you can get plenty of "I made this in my freentime and upstreamed it" integrations that end up going through major renovations. Sometimes vendors take notice and also weigh in. Additionally, if you got in ~5 years ago when it was pure yaml, it seems a couple times a year there's breaking changes where more yaml is ripped out and manual reconfig is necessary (it'd be nice if it just migrated the config for you)

PurpleRamen 3y ago

> I don't know where all the frustration with HA is coming from Because it's breaking all the time. They have a big surface, and integrations are changing fast, this is natural. But at the same time they are also eager to change and break things on their own software, and this all accumulates to a messy experience for many people.

billfor 3y ago
It’s not natural. I use both hA and Openhab with about 20 integrations/addons and HA breaks more (hello zwave}. Openhab almost never breaks on an addon level. If it breaks at all it’s in the core and patched quickly.
- throitallaway 3y ago
  How HA has handled ZWave is my only complaint with HA.

mongol 3y ago

If you only had it for a year, you may not have seen it yet. I had lots of configs setup, then I did not have it running for a year or so. Trying to make it run again on the latest version was frustrating. I want to set up and forget to the largest extent possible.