4 ms·

Mo tech mo problems. My 87 Toyota 4x4, 89 bmw e30, 83 Toyota Land Cruiser and 76 bmw e10 are an effortless joy to drive (for someone with a little mechanical ac

Mo tech mo problems. My 87 Toyota 4x4, 89 bmw e30, 83 Toyota Land Cruiser and 76 bmw e10 are an effortless joy to drive (for someone with a little mechanical acumen). I call upon you all: reclaim agency over your driving experience, learn how a carb works, drive a cool classic and cut bullshit tech out of your life (while not contributing to the throwaway culture lithium ion has brought us).

bandyaboot 3y ago
Bring back carbs and crank starts! I miss the days of getting a free buzz from the gas fumes when walking through a parking lot.
TylerE 3y ago
I know how all that works. I also know how modern cars are designed to survive collisions. You can keep 'em. I'd consider something like as a fun weekend car, but it's be relegated to rural backroads and track days.
- CamperBob2 3y ago
  That reasoning hurts my head. "Those cars are dangerous. I'd like one, too, but only so I could drive it under conditions associated with the highest possible fatality rates per vehicle-mile."
  - TylerE 3y ago
    Huh? How is a rural road or parking lot with literally no other cars around "the highest possible fatality rate"? It's not ME that scares me. It's Sally Mae driving a 7 thousand pound Suburban while talking on the phone and putting on make up. She won't even notice anything smaller than a full size sedan.
    - serf 3y ago
      lack of response during an incident, poor road conditions, little or no flood control, rapidly changing road conditions over timne poor lighting, randomized rural traffic (tractors/goats/whatever), and inconsistent street placement. rural driving has always been historically pretty dangerous, even on an otherwise empty road.
      - TylerE 3y ago
        It's a weekend car. It's not going out when it's rainy, and also not at night.
    - CamperBob2 3y ago
      Huh? How is a rural road or parking lot with literally no other cars around "the highest possible fatality rate"? Sure, not many people die in autocross events. It happens, but so rarely it's ignorable. But you said "track days." That's different. Safety is (ideally) considered a higher priority there, not a lower one.
      - TylerE 3y ago
        Track day fatalities are also extremely rare. Most tracks have tons of run off, and obviously one should drive within ones on capabilities. One of the big differences is response time. If you had a wreck at a track day, you’d be noticed within 30 seconds and the on-site EMS at the accident site within a few minutes. That vastly improves your odds. It’s all about determining risk vs reward. Driving in track once or twice a year is relatively low risk (annd those risks are largely within one’s own control) and lots of fun (and more fun the more fun the car is). A fun car is not going to make sitting in traffic more funz If it’s a fun car with a stick, aftermarket clutch, lightened flywhweel, etc it’s gonna be miserable around town, and when you get hit by some idiot that runs a red light, it’s probably not going to go especially well for you. For a faily I’ll take big crumple zones and 17 airbags, blind spot warnings, etc etc.
        TylerE 3y ago
        Also, I meant to add, most of the fatalities that do occur have underlying medical causes (e.g. heart attack during the session).
foobarian 3y ago
Carbs... why? You must be sarcastic or something. How do you deal with carb problems?
- I_Am_Nous 3y ago
  Clean them :) That said, you can tune a carb with a screwdriver. You can't tune an ECU with a screwdriver. So you can make a barely functioning carb vehicle run again relatively easily, for years, with minimal parts required. Usually it just needs some cleaning if it sat too long. Compare that to a car that requires the entire electrical system and computer to function to even start moving gas from the tank to the injectors sometimes, a vehicle with a carb can be built like a lawn mower - simple fuel system, basic electronics, and you can make a reliable enough vehicle that's intended to be repaired.
  - maxerickson 3y ago
    Fuel injection systems are pretty reliable by now. Like sure, you are not gonna tune them with a screwdriver, but in exchange it more or less just operates the engine on the best available point all the time.
mortos 3y ago
None of those cars have airbags right? Those are all awesome cars but I can't daily something that dangerous
zxexz 3y ago
Cars from the mid-noughts (the right ones of course! [0]) are the sweet-spot for me. New enough to have modern safety features (like airbags - I know, funny to refer to that as modern) - but still be user-serviceable. I bought an relatively "bad condition", top of the line (at the time) 4Runner for well less than 10 grand, spent 40 hours of effort on DIY repairs and maintenance over the course of a month. Ended up with a "bulletproof" machine that not only passed inspection - it's a pleasure to drive, is modded to my liking. That 40 hours of effort would have been less than 10 for a seasoned mechanic, and the bill would have brought the total cost of the car to maybe just slightly over $10k. Finding a physical copy of the service and repair "manual" (it's 8 volumes...) for the exact make, model and year of the car was easy and cost $100. Spent a few hundred on specialized tools, and about 1.5k on parts. The car is old enough that there are several old-school forums with a wealth of knowledge on everything from muffler replacement, rust-removal tactics, to transfer case repair - and those forums are still incredibly active! Also, now that I'm apparently mind dumping, my personal advice for people living in rust-prone areas (the rust belt, northeast, etc.) - if you can, get a used vehicle from another area. If you can't - fine - but make sure you can inspect the frame rust, do the "hammer check", etc. Remove any rust you can, get an undercoating, and wash regularly (especially during winter). BUT don't be too scared of some frame rust, especially if the price is right. Lots of body-on-frame cars/trucks are actually pretty structurally repairable if you hire a good tech to do the rust cleaning, sawing, and welding. Also, a frame swap is actually quite doable for a few grand if you find a good shop (people do do it themselves but without experience and a full shop it's a pretty dangerous and hardcore endeavor) and are able to source a frame (often less than $1k plus a few hundred in shipping from a scrap yard in the south - or just buy a second used car that's "worthless" for all the reasons yours isn't, and swap that frame). [0] My experience with cars of this era is mostly with Toyotas and Subarus - both makes are very user-serviceable (IME Subarus are easier, but on average the parts more bespoke and more expensive, Toyotas are more finnicky to work with on average but way cheaper part-wise and way easier to patch together in a pinch). I've worked on a Honda Pilot from that era, it was also a breeze - and tons of DIY-focused car people are "Honda for life". I know a couple people who swear by Nissans from that era, but they caveat that with transmission issues for certain models in certain years (I don't remember which).

bandyaboot 3y ago

Bring back carbs and crank starts! I miss the days of getting a free buzz from the gas fumes when walking through a parking lot.

TylerE 3y ago

I know how all that works. I also know how modern cars are designed to survive collisions. You can keep 'em. I'd consider something like as a fun weekend car, but it's be relegated to rural backroads and track days.

CamperBob2 3y ago
That reasoning hurts my head. "Those cars are dangerous. I'd like one, too, but only so I could drive it under conditions associated with the highest possible fatality rates per vehicle-mile."
- TylerE 3y ago
  Huh? How is a rural road or parking lot with literally no other cars around "the highest possible fatality rate"? It's not ME that scares me. It's Sally Mae driving a 7 thousand pound Suburban while talking on the phone and putting on make up. She won't even notice anything smaller than a full size sedan.
  - serf 3y ago
    lack of response during an incident, poor road conditions, little or no flood control, rapidly changing road conditions over timne poor lighting, randomized rural traffic (tractors/goats/whatever), and inconsistent street placement. rural driving has always been historically pretty dangerous, even on an otherwise empty road.
    - TylerE 3y ago
      It's a weekend car. It's not going out when it's rainy, and also not at night.
  - CamperBob2 3y ago
    Huh? How is a rural road or parking lot with literally no other cars around "the highest possible fatality rate"? Sure, not many people die in autocross events. It happens, but so rarely it's ignorable. But you said "track days." That's different. Safety is (ideally) considered a higher priority there, not a lower one.
    - TylerE 3y ago
      Track day fatalities are also extremely rare. Most tracks have tons of run off, and obviously one should drive within ones on capabilities. One of the big differences is response time. If you had a wreck at a track day, you’d be noticed within 30 seconds and the on-site EMS at the accident site within a few minutes. That vastly improves your odds. It’s all about determining risk vs reward. Driving in track once or twice a year is relatively low risk (annd those risks are largely within one’s own control) and lots of fun (and more fun the more fun the car is). A fun car is not going to make sitting in traffic more funz If it’s a fun car with a stick, aftermarket clutch, lightened flywhweel, etc it’s gonna be miserable around town, and when you get hit by some idiot that runs a red light, it’s probably not going to go especially well for you. For a faily I’ll take big crumple zones and 17 airbags, blind spot warnings, etc etc.
      - TylerE 3y ago
        Also, I meant to add, most of the fatalities that do occur have underlying medical causes (e.g. heart attack during the session).

foobarian 3y ago

Carbs... why? You must be sarcastic or something. How do you deal with carb problems?

I_Am_Nous 3y ago
Clean them :) That said, you can tune a carb with a screwdriver. You can't tune an ECU with a screwdriver. So you can make a barely functioning carb vehicle run again relatively easily, for years, with minimal parts required. Usually it just needs some cleaning if it sat too long. Compare that to a car that requires the entire electrical system and computer to function to even start moving gas from the tank to the injectors sometimes, a vehicle with a carb can be built like a lawn mower - simple fuel system, basic electronics, and you can make a reliable enough vehicle that's intended to be repaired.
- maxerickson 3y ago
  Fuel injection systems are pretty reliable by now. Like sure, you are not gonna tune them with a screwdriver, but in exchange it more or less just operates the engine on the best available point all the time.

mortos 3y ago

None of those cars have airbags right? Those are all awesome cars but I can't daily something that dangerous

zxexz 3y ago

Cars from the mid-noughts (the right ones of course! [0]) are the sweet-spot for me. New enough to have modern safety features (like airbags - I know, funny to refer to that as modern) - but still be user-serviceable. I bought an relatively "bad condition", top of the line (at the time) 4Runner for well less than 10 grand, spent 40 hours of effort on DIY repairs and maintenance over the course of a month. Ended up with a "bulletproof" machine that not only passed inspection - it's a pleasure to drive, is modded to my liking. That 40 hours of effort would have been less than 10 for a seasoned mechanic, and the bill would have brought the total cost of the car to maybe just slightly over $10k. Finding a physical copy of the service and repair "manual" (it's 8 volumes...) for the exact make, model and year of the car was easy and cost $100. Spent a few hundred on specialized tools, and about 1.5k on parts. The car is old enough that there are several old-school forums with a wealth of knowledge on everything from muffler replacement, rust-removal tactics, to transfer case repair - and those forums are still incredibly active! Also, now that I'm apparently mind dumping, my personal advice for people living in rust-prone areas (the rust belt, northeast, etc.) - if you can, get a used vehicle from another area. If you can't - fine - but make sure you can inspect the frame rust, do the "hammer check", etc. Remove any rust you can, get an undercoating, and wash regularly (especially during winter). BUT don't be too scared of some frame rust, especially if the price is right. Lots of body-on-frame cars/trucks are actually pretty structurally repairable if you hire a good tech to do the rust cleaning, sawing, and welding. Also, a frame swap is actually quite doable for a few grand if you find a good shop (people do do it themselves but without experience and a full shop it's a pretty dangerous and hardcore endeavor) and are able to source a frame (often less than $1k plus a few hundred in shipping from a scrap yard in the south - or just buy a second used car that's "worthless" for all the reasons yours isn't, and swap that frame). [0] My experience with cars of this era is mostly with Toyotas and Subarus - both makes are very user-serviceable (IME Subarus are easier, but on average the parts more bespoke and more expensive, Toyotas are more finnicky to work with on average but way cheaper part-wise and way easier to patch together in a pinch). I've worked on a Honda Pilot from that era, it was also a breeze - and tons of DIY-focused car people are "Honda for life". I know a couple people who swear by Nissans from that era, but they caveat that with transmission issues for certain models in certain years (I don't remember which).