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> Nobody’s trying to actively prevent the smart kids from learning This is false. Why else ban teaching algebra district-wide to 8th graders? The explicit just

> Nobody’s trying to actively prevent the smart kids from learning This is false. Why else ban teaching algebra district-wide to 8th graders? The explicit justification is that it helps some students get too far ahead of other students and causes inequitable access to take calculus classes later on, which is considered a bad thing. Teachers even complain if you help your child accelerate through the textbook for the year.

dahart 3y ago
Who’s “banning” math, exactly? Give me examples and specifics, and please elaborate on what the difference is between a ban and not offering advanced math. You’re basing your argument on the imaginary hyperbolic terminology of the above comment.
- scarmig 3y ago
  Aside from the ridiculousness of calling 8th grade algebra "advanced math" (I was taking the equivalent in 6th grade where I grew up, in a low-income public school), "giving directives that schools are not to devote any resources to teaching 8th grade algebra" is in every sense equivalent to "banning teaching algebra." If a state did the same thing with LGBT topics or evolution, I suspect you'd take no issue with calling it a ban.
  - lawlessone 3y ago
    >If a state did the same thing with LGBT topics or evolution, I suspect you'd take no issue with calling it a ban. Why are so many that hate public schools so focused on these two things? I don't think there's an evolution class, but it would be covered in biology.
    - scarmig 3y ago
      No one here (certainly not me) wants those topics banned from schools. It's just I also don't think 8th grade algebra should be banned.
      - ryan_lane 3y ago
        A lot of folks who do homeschooling do it particularly because they don't want their children to learn evolution, or have sex education. They do want those things banned in schools and since they can't get them banned have rage quit the system.
    - lobocinza 3y ago
      Due to polarization. People are herded to fight over stupid but controversial things so things never change. That said, parents in general invest and care a lot about their V2s than any government could ever lie about. Inevitably their children will be indoctrinated to believe in things that go against their values and they will be rightfully pissed off and afraid.
  - dahart 3y ago
    > If a state did the same thing with LGBT topics or evolution Hahaha you mean the topics that are actually getting banned in states like Florida and Kentucky? > giving directives that schools are not to devote any resources to teaching 8th grade algebra is in every sense equivalent to “banning teaching algebra” Again, please provide some specific examples of this happening. Are you getting all worked up over something that is mostly made up or taken completely out of context? No way to know unless you cite the actual problem and demonstrate the magnitude of the problem. Of course there absolutely is a huge difference between not having the resources for a class and banning it by law, and you know it. You can argue the outcomes might be equivalent, if you want, but it undermines your own argument to exaggerate.
    - scarmig 3y ago
      > Again, please provide some specific examples of this happening I can't speak to local school board politics outside of SFUSD, but here's a particular example: https://www.sfexaminer.com/forum/put-algebra-1-back-in-eighth-grade/article_01ca608e-be01-11ed-9d12-5fb4111a4db8.html https://www.sfexaminer.com/forum/put-algebra-1-back-in-eight... Opinion piece, but substantive. https://www.sfchronicle.com/bayarea/article/sfusd-algebra-math-wars-stanford-study-17851567.php https://www.sfchronicle.com/bayarea/article/sfusd-algebra-ma... A more recent piece.
      - dahart 3y ago
        Thanks, specifics are helpful, especially when broad generalizations are being thrown around. Googling it I can see that SFUSD is reconsidering https://www.sfusd.edu/about-sfusd/sfusd-news/press-releases/2023-10-02-sfusd-focus-group-examine-access-and-implementation-algebra-1-8th-grade https://www.sfusd.edu/about-sfusd/sfusd-news/press-releases/...
        ndriscoll 3y ago
        From your link > The question is not if we can increase acceleration options, but how we can meet that need equitably and while upholding our SFUSD values Says it all. They have the resources, but still don't want to do it because outcomes will (obviously) diverge.
  - sastaha 3y ago
    "Again, please provide some specific examples of this happening." Here you go: https://www.bostonglobe.com/2023/07/14/metro/cambridge-schools-divided-over-middle-school-math/ https://www.bostonglobe.com/2023/07/14/metro/cambridge-schoo... I'm sure you'll move the goalposts and say it doesn't count.

dahart 3y ago

Who’s “banning” math, exactly? Give me examples and specifics, and please elaborate on what the difference is between a ban and not offering advanced math. You’re basing your argument on the imaginary hyperbolic terminology of the above comment.

scarmig 3y ago
Aside from the ridiculousness of calling 8th grade algebra "advanced math" (I was taking the equivalent in 6th grade where I grew up, in a low-income public school), "giving directives that schools are not to devote any resources to teaching 8th grade algebra" is in every sense equivalent to "banning teaching algebra." If a state did the same thing with LGBT topics or evolution, I suspect you'd take no issue with calling it a ban.
- lawlessone 3y ago
  >If a state did the same thing with LGBT topics or evolution, I suspect you'd take no issue with calling it a ban. Why are so many that hate public schools so focused on these two things? I don't think there's an evolution class, but it would be covered in biology.
  - scarmig 3y ago
    No one here (certainly not me) wants those topics banned from schools. It's just I also don't think 8th grade algebra should be banned.
    - ryan_lane 3y ago
      A lot of folks who do homeschooling do it particularly because they don't want their children to learn evolution, or have sex education. They do want those things banned in schools and since they can't get them banned have rage quit the system.
  - lobocinza 3y ago
    Due to polarization. People are herded to fight over stupid but controversial things so things never change. That said, parents in general invest and care a lot about their V2s than any government could ever lie about. Inevitably their children will be indoctrinated to believe in things that go against their values and they will be rightfully pissed off and afraid.
- dahart 3y ago
  > If a state did the same thing with LGBT topics or evolution Hahaha you mean the topics that are actually getting banned in states like Florida and Kentucky? > giving directives that schools are not to devote any resources to teaching 8th grade algebra is in every sense equivalent to “banning teaching algebra” Again, please provide some specific examples of this happening. Are you getting all worked up over something that is mostly made up or taken completely out of context? No way to know unless you cite the actual problem and demonstrate the magnitude of the problem. Of course there absolutely is a huge difference between not having the resources for a class and banning it by law, and you know it. You can argue the outcomes might be equivalent, if you want, but it undermines your own argument to exaggerate.
  - scarmig 3y ago
    > Again, please provide some specific examples of this happening I can't speak to local school board politics outside of SFUSD, but here's a particular example: https://www.sfexaminer.com/forum/put-algebra-1-back-in-eighth-grade/article_01ca608e-be01-11ed-9d12-5fb4111a4db8.html https://www.sfexaminer.com/forum/put-algebra-1-back-in-eight... Opinion piece, but substantive. https://www.sfchronicle.com/bayarea/article/sfusd-algebra-math-wars-stanford-study-17851567.php https://www.sfchronicle.com/bayarea/article/sfusd-algebra-ma... A more recent piece.
    - dahart 3y ago
      Thanks, specifics are helpful, especially when broad generalizations are being thrown around. Googling it I can see that SFUSD is reconsidering https://www.sfusd.edu/about-sfusd/sfusd-news/press-releases/2023-10-02-sfusd-focus-group-examine-access-and-implementation-algebra-1-8th-grade https://www.sfusd.edu/about-sfusd/sfusd-news/press-releases/...
      - ndriscoll 3y ago
        From your link > The question is not if we can increase acceleration options, but how we can meet that need equitably and while upholding our SFUSD values Says it all. They have the resources, but still don't want to do it because outcomes will (obviously) diverge.
- sastaha 3y ago
  "Again, please provide some specific examples of this happening." Here you go: https://www.bostonglobe.com/2023/07/14/metro/cambridge-schools-divided-over-middle-school-math/ https://www.bostonglobe.com/2023/07/14/metro/cambridge-schoo... I'm sure you'll move the goalposts and say it doesn't count.