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Here is Red Pine's translation of both, in case you are interested. He spent ~20 years including substantial time in monasteries studying Chinese classics. His
by stillconfused 3y ago
Here is Red Pine's translation of both, in case you are interested. He spent ~20 years including substantial time in monasteries studying Chinese classics.
His translation is much more tightly linked to the actual work.
4:
The Tao is so empty
those who use it
never become full again
and so deep
as if were the ancestor of us all
it dulls our edges
unties our tangles
softens our light
and merges our dust
it's so clear
as if it were present
I wonder whose child it is
it seems it was here before Ti
9:
Instead of pouring in more
better stop while you can
making it sharper
won't help it last longer
rooms full of treasure
can never be safe
the vanity of success
invites its own failure
when your work is done retire
this is the Way of Heaven
Notice how different, in particular, 4. The text reads much, much closer to Red Pine's translation. The 4th line literally reads "deep !", but that word is nowhere to be found in Mitchell's translation.
I strongly recommend Red Pine!
- vitiral 3y agoAre there two versions in the same translation? You gave two versions to number 9 in this very post!
- stillconfused 3y agoHi- Those are the same translation (Red Pine's) of the two sections from Mitchell that you quoted, 4 and 9. They are quite different than Mitchell, and correspond about as closely as one can to the text (given assumptions on punctuation; Classical Chinese was not punctuated). To give a bit more detail of the first one, 4: Mitchell 4a: The Tao is like a well: used but never used up. It is like the eternal void: filled with infinite possibilities. 1. The original text does not mention a well. 2. those who use it are not full, not the Tao not used up. 3. there is no mention of eternal voids just a lack of fullness for users. 4. there is no mention of infinite impossibilities, but it is possible "as it were the ancestor of us all" is mistranslated by Mitchell where "all" wan wu (literally 10,000 things) is translated as infinite, and the ancestor part is dropped. Mitchel 4b: <blank> It appears Mitchell skips the middle part of the section, which discusses dulled edges, tangles, light, and dust. Mitchell 4c: It is hidden but always present. I don't know who gave birth to it. It is older than God. 1. The first half is clear / as if it were present, not hidden. The rest is reasonable. By all means if you found something in Mitchell, enjoy, but he's taken many liberties while translated a language he did not understand, and so it doesn't match the original text as well as other alternatives.
- gizajob 3y agoIt seems like his is a much more zen-infused translation, which given his other work isn’t surprising. It’s great to have so many takes on the translation though, I’ll be appreciating this text for the rest of my life. Already have been for a good 15 years already, and whoever old Lao Tze was, they were likely one of the greatest geniuses in history.