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> Do you prefer your secular type What is secular indoctrination? Kids who grow up without a religion doesn't get told anything, all you have to do is to not i

> Do you prefer your secular type What is secular indoctrination? Kids who grow up without a religion doesn't get told anything, all you have to do is to not indoctrinate the kid into a religion. There is still school etc, but removing religious indoctrination doesn't add anything else, its just less indoctrination overall.

lolinder 3y ago
> Kids who grow up without a religion doesn't get told anything I work in edtech with a bunch of former teachers, and this is absolutely untrue. Many elementary and middle school teachers see part of their role (regardless of the subject they're officially teaching) as being to teach morals to their students, and the morality that they choose to teach is every bit as subjective as the morality that comes out of a religion. And if it's not their teachers teaching them morals, then it's their parents. You can't raise a child without intentionally or unintentionally instilling in them your own value system. The biggest factor in whether someone feels that something is "indoctrination" isn't whether it originates from a religion but whether they agree with the principles being taught.
- Jensson 3y ago
  You missed the last line I wrote, I never said there weren't other forms of indoctrination: > There is still school etc, but removing religious indoctrination doesn't add anything else, its just less indoctrination overall. I should probably have clarified it in the first bit that I meant that the kids weren't told anything about religion, not that the kids aren't told anything at all. My point is that there is no indoctrination required to raise a kid without religion, it is the natural state. I and most people I grew up with were raised that way, religion was stories we read about in school, not some magical thing.
  - lolinder 3y ago
    I didn't miss it, I disagree with the idea that it's less indoctrination overall: it's just more homogenous indoctrination. A kid who gets taught religion at home and secular values at school is less indoctrinated than a kid who gets secular values in both places.
    - Jensson 3y ago
      What are "secular values"? Do you mean that things like "you shouldn't hurt others" are secular values? Otherwise I don't understand. If that is what you mean then I'm pretty sure that even religious homes teaches secular values.
      - mensetmanusman 3y ago
        In some areas, secular values are ‘whatever you think about yourself is true’ or ‘you do you’ relativism (apathy).
- wredue 3y ago
  Err no. The teachers generally push an empathy based approach to morality, which is absolutely not subjective. Adopting empathy can cause a number of objective moral pronouncements on a good foundation. I will take empathy based moral pronouncements over “the bible says so” any day of the week.

lolinder 3y ago

> Kids who grow up without a religion doesn't get told anything I work in edtech with a bunch of former teachers, and this is absolutely untrue. Many elementary and middle school teachers see part of their role (regardless of the subject they're officially teaching) as being to teach morals to their students, and the morality that they choose to teach is every bit as subjective as the morality that comes out of a religion. And if it's not their teachers teaching them morals, then it's their parents. You can't raise a child without intentionally or unintentionally instilling in them your own value system. The biggest factor in whether someone feels that something is "indoctrination" isn't whether it originates from a religion but whether they agree with the principles being taught.

Jensson 3y ago
You missed the last line I wrote, I never said there weren't other forms of indoctrination: > There is still school etc, but removing religious indoctrination doesn't add anything else, its just less indoctrination overall. I should probably have clarified it in the first bit that I meant that the kids weren't told anything about religion, not that the kids aren't told anything at all. My point is that there is no indoctrination required to raise a kid without religion, it is the natural state. I and most people I grew up with were raised that way, religion was stories we read about in school, not some magical thing.
- lolinder 3y ago
  I didn't miss it, I disagree with the idea that it's less indoctrination overall: it's just more homogenous indoctrination. A kid who gets taught religion at home and secular values at school is less indoctrinated than a kid who gets secular values in both places.
  - Jensson 3y ago
    What are "secular values"? Do you mean that things like "you shouldn't hurt others" are secular values? Otherwise I don't understand. If that is what you mean then I'm pretty sure that even religious homes teaches secular values.
    - mensetmanusman 3y ago
      In some areas, secular values are ‘whatever you think about yourself is true’ or ‘you do you’ relativism (apathy).
wredue 3y ago
Err no. The teachers generally push an empathy based approach to morality, which is absolutely not subjective. Adopting empathy can cause a number of objective moral pronouncements on a good foundation. I will take empathy based moral pronouncements over “the bible says so” any day of the week.