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> Now I think AMD and Intel caught up enough Interesting. I don't really like Apple, mainly because of how they handle the app store vendor lock in stuff, and

> Now I think AMD and Intel caught up enough Interesting. I don't really like Apple, mainly because of how they handle the app store vendor lock in stuff, and I hate macOS. But I use an M2 MBP purely because I can't find any other laptop that has the same fast performance, long battery life, quiet fan noise, no heat. Can you recommend an AMD/Intel or anything that comes close? I'd switch in a heartbeat. The closest that comes to mind is the ThinkPad X13s.

leonroy 3y ago
I just bought a Thinkpad T14S Gen3 after evaluating a bunch of notebooks. Compared to my Macbook Air the Mac excels in a couple of areas which Thinkpad is lacking in. Like ambient light sensor, port quality (ie. how recessed the USB-C port is and how much strain it can take), audio output quality (Macs have powered headphone jacks for high impedance headphones) and of course speaker quality which on Macs is second to none. The Thinkpad by comparison has poor quality speakers, no ambient light sensor so it doesn't auto adjust the screen or keyboard backlight. Its USB-C ports are also not very strong so the any strain on them or wiggle will cause them to disconnect - they certainly feel very fragile. I hear the Thinkpad Z13/Z16 is more comparable to a Macbook but again it doesn't have little details like an ambient light sensor which seems an odd omission in a luxury laptop and price wise it's practically the same. That said, the new AMD Ryzen 7840HS and 7940HS chips are pretty competitive with an equivalent Apple M2: https://browser.geekbench.com/processors/amd-ryzen-9-7940hs https://browser.geekbench.com/processors/amd-ryzen-9-7940hs https://browser.geekbench.com/macs/mac14-15 https://browser.geekbench.com/macs/mac14-15
- LtdJorge 3y ago
  And GeekBench is a pretty bad benchmark. There's also the 7945HX which is a 16 core CPU, but only comes with big dedicated GPUs, sadly.
pb7 3y ago
> I don't really like Apple, mainly because of how they handle the app store vendor lock in stuff, and I hate macOS. But I use an M2 MBP purely because I can't find any other laptop that has the same fast performance, long battery life, quiet fan noise, no heat. Buying their products for the same reason everyone else does is "liking Apple".
- simjnd 3y ago
  You can like or use a product without liking the company making it or its practices
  - pb7 3y ago
    Your only relationship to the company is via the goods and services it sells to you. If you buy their products, you like the company and their practices. The product is the culmination of all of their practices.
    - jodrellblank 3y ago
      "I don't like being a galley slave but if I stop rowing, they whip me" "Rowing for the same reason everyone else rows is 'liking slavery'". Counter-proof by reductio ad absurdum.
      - toyg 3y ago
        So you admit of being a prisoner in an ecosystem built to ruthlessly exploit you...?
        jodrellblank 3y ago
        I own zero Apple laptops, desktops, watches or subscriptions, and one low spec. 2016 iPhone bought second hand. That's hardly being a prisoner or being ruthlessly exploited, is it? If you hate Disney's Frozen because you've seen it so many times, but you watch it with your daughter because she likes Frozen, does that mean you like Frozen because you're doing the same thing that people who like it are doing? No; people's motivation for the same thing can be different. People can do thing they disapprove of, for reasons other than approving of thing.
        toyg 3y ago
        But as far as the market is concerned, if one has a choice and exercises it, they liked the product better than the alternatives. Nobody on the Apple galley was ever really forced to be there.
rafaelmn 3y ago
I use my laptop as a portable workstation so I rarely use built in keyboard, touchpad, battery, etc. From what I see AMD 7840 CPUs deliver similar performance to M2. I think I'll get an Framework 16 or 13 with AMD in a few months, will make sure Linux drivers are in order before ordering.

leonroy 3y ago

I just bought a Thinkpad T14S Gen3 after evaluating a bunch of notebooks. Compared to my Macbook Air the Mac excels in a couple of areas which Thinkpad is lacking in. Like ambient light sensor, port quality (ie. how recessed the USB-C port is and how much strain it can take), audio output quality (Macs have powered headphone jacks for high impedance headphones) and of course speaker quality which on Macs is second to none. The Thinkpad by comparison has poor quality speakers, no ambient light sensor so it doesn't auto adjust the screen or keyboard backlight. Its USB-C ports are also not very strong so the any strain on them or wiggle will cause them to disconnect - they certainly feel very fragile. I hear the Thinkpad Z13/Z16 is more comparable to a Macbook but again it doesn't have little details like an ambient light sensor which seems an odd omission in a luxury laptop and price wise it's practically the same. That said, the new AMD Ryzen 7840HS and 7940HS chips are pretty competitive with an equivalent Apple M2: https://browser.geekbench.com/processors/amd-ryzen-9-7940hs https://browser.geekbench.com/processors/amd-ryzen-9-7940hs https://browser.geekbench.com/macs/mac14-15 https://browser.geekbench.com/macs/mac14-15

LtdJorge 3y ago
And GeekBench is a pretty bad benchmark. There's also the 7945HX which is a 16 core CPU, but only comes with big dedicated GPUs, sadly.

pb7 3y ago

> I don't really like Apple, mainly because of how they handle the app store vendor lock in stuff, and I hate macOS. But I use an M2 MBP purely because I can't find any other laptop that has the same fast performance, long battery life, quiet fan noise, no heat. Buying their products for the same reason everyone else does is "liking Apple".

simjnd 3y ago
You can like or use a product without liking the company making it or its practices
- pb7 3y ago
  Your only relationship to the company is via the goods and services it sells to you. If you buy their products, you like the company and their practices. The product is the culmination of all of their practices.
  - jodrellblank 3y ago
    "I don't like being a galley slave but if I stop rowing, they whip me" "Rowing for the same reason everyone else rows is 'liking slavery'". Counter-proof by reductio ad absurdum.
    - toyg 3y ago
      So you admit of being a prisoner in an ecosystem built to ruthlessly exploit you...?
      - jodrellblank 3y ago
        I own zero Apple laptops, desktops, watches or subscriptions, and one low spec. 2016 iPhone bought second hand. That's hardly being a prisoner or being ruthlessly exploited, is it? If you hate Disney's Frozen because you've seen it so many times, but you watch it with your daughter because she likes Frozen, does that mean you like Frozen because you're doing the same thing that people who like it are doing? No; people's motivation for the same thing can be different. People can do thing they disapprove of, for reasons other than approving of thing.
        toyg 3y ago
        But as far as the market is concerned, if one has a choice and exercises it, they liked the product better than the alternatives. Nobody on the Apple galley was ever really forced to be there.

rafaelmn 3y ago

I use my laptop as a portable workstation so I rarely use built in keyboard, touchpad, battery, etc. From what I see AMD 7840 CPUs deliver similar performance to M2. I think I'll get an Framework 16 or 13 with AMD in a few months, will make sure Linux drivers are in order before ordering.