6 ms·

If economics ruled the Church, there are many dogmas that do not "play well to peasants" that could be dropped tomorrow for the sake of propagation.

by hudon 3y ago

XorNot 3y ago
This is an odd take considering the Catholic church via the Vatican was one of the most powerful and wealthiest organizations in Europe for many centuries, able to topple monarchs.
- hudon 3y ago
  The point stands: if your argument were true of the Catholic Church being ruled by money and doing whatever it economically can do to propagate, the Church would behave much differently than it currently does. But, the Church is not doing everything economically possible to propagate today, so there must be some other ruling principle.
  - XorNot 3y ago
    "economics" doesn't mean "money", it means the allocation of resources. You're treating this whole idea as though there's a nefarious organization deliberately managing things (which there is in some cases, but the why is unacknowledged). But a cell in your body has an energy economy that means it adopts certain strategies based on it's constraints. Similarly, successful religions have an economy of beliefs that they have to adopt based on constraints. Almost all religions portray an afterlife, so all religions have a problem where they need to stop people short-cutting to get there - otherwise they promptly stop existing. But then they also have followers with limited resources so they also can't preach infinite life-extension since that undermines the afterlife narrative, and is economically unfeasible for followers (particularly since you also need to collect donations to your church to keep the organizational structure running).
    - deleted 3y ago
      [deleted]
    - hudon 3y ago
      A belief is economical if it exists today, and existing beliefs are economical. This tautological line of reasoning doesn't help explain the Catholic approach to anything.
      - XorNot 3y ago
        What's tautological? How are the Branch Davidians doing? Heaven's Gate? I note you keep insisting "they would change beliefs" but you've neglected to ever include what changes you think would obviously disprove this hypothesis.

If economics ruled the Church, there are many dogmas that do not "play well to peasants" that could be dropped tomorrow for the sake of propagation.

by hudon 3y ago

If economics ruled the Church, there are many dogmas that do not "play well to peasants" that could be dropped tomorrow for the sake of propagation.

XorNot 3y ago

This is an odd take considering the Catholic church via the Vatican was one of the most powerful and wealthiest organizations in Europe for many centuries, able to topple monarchs.

hudon 3y ago
The point stands: if your argument were true of the Catholic Church being ruled by money and doing whatever it economically can do to propagate, the Church would behave much differently than it currently does. But, the Church is not doing everything economically possible to propagate today, so there must be some other ruling principle.
- XorNot 3y ago
  "economics" doesn't mean "money", it means the allocation of resources. You're treating this whole idea as though there's a nefarious organization deliberately managing things (which there is in some cases, but the why is unacknowledged). But a cell in your body has an energy economy that means it adopts certain strategies based on it's constraints. Similarly, successful religions have an economy of beliefs that they have to adopt based on constraints. Almost all religions portray an afterlife, so all religions have a problem where they need to stop people short-cutting to get there - otherwise they promptly stop existing. But then they also have followers with limited resources so they also can't preach infinite life-extension since that undermines the afterlife narrative, and is economically unfeasible for followers (particularly since you also need to collect donations to your church to keep the organizational structure running).
  - deleted 3y ago
    [deleted]
  - hudon 3y ago
    A belief is economical if it exists today, and existing beliefs are economical. This tautological line of reasoning doesn't help explain the Catholic approach to anything.
    - XorNot 3y ago
      What's tautological? How are the Branch Davidians doing? Heaven's Gate? I note you keep insisting "they would change beliefs" but you've neglected to ever include what changes you think would obviously disprove this hypothesis.