4 ms·

> an Iron Age man who said he was as "mighty" as a god I wonder if such people were actually believed (by their followers or by themselves) wielding enormous s

> an Iron Age man who said he was as "mighty" as a god I wonder if such people were actually believed (by their followers or by themselves) wielding enormous supernatural powers or if descriptions of this kind were just political flattery.

gleenn 3y ago
2100 years ago was before Christ and at least a few people think he's pretty important. Seems reasonable to assume there was enough mysticism that people would believe it.
- qwerty456127 3y ago
  > Seems reasonable to assume there was enough mysticism Is there a reason to believe ancient people had no skepticism and popularly took mysticism seriously?
  - carbotaniuman 3y ago
    Even today there are people who have little skepticism and take mysticism seriously, it is likely that any evidence against this person did not survive the times.
    - qwerty456127 3y ago
      Indeed. Even today "there are people...". What I am curious about is how much does the average degree of seriousness differ between our and their times. We seemingly tend to assume people of the distant past predominantly were extremely naïve and sincerely believed whatever we find written by them. But what if they were almost as rational as modern people are and that's we who are naïve when reasoning about their beliefs?
      - Loughla 3y ago
        I think it's less about being naive and more about the base of information. I believe I need antibiotics when I have an appropriate infection, because modern medicine has built an entire catalogue of reasons. If we don't have that information, and we do have "experts" saying it's because our autumn sacrifice wasn't good enough, then my guess is that's what most people will believe. Make the best choice you can with the available information, sort of thing.
      - WalterBright 3y ago
        Modern people are driven by cognitive biases and emotion. They then attempt to justify these decisions after the fact with logical fallacies.
  - skinner927 3y ago
    When a bad harvest, a pack of hungry wolves, violent neighbors, or a small cut that becomes infected, are all life threatening possibilities, I think mysticism overrules skepticism.
  - AlotOfReading 3y ago
    People were skeptical then as well. What you're missing is that religion in the premodern world had political and cultural dimensions that are largely non-existent in modern Western society. Rejecting someone's divinity when the current political leader legitimizes their rule by descent from that person is also rejecting the current political leaders. That's could be quite a dangerous statement to make, so it's one you'll be relatively quiet about compared to the people writing mythical stories into official histories that survived to the present day.
    - qwerty456127 3y ago
      I'm not missing this. Quite contrary - this is exactly what I mean. Even today I would run around and yell our president is a superhero, maybe even pretend I mean that literally, if I somehow believed this could do real good and no harm and the president was doing a good job. Needless to say I would hardly believe he can see through walls and will fly to save me in case of an emergency.
anonymouskimmer 3y ago
It might just have been the name his parents gave him. In such cases it would just be an aspirational name such as Chastity, or one meant to draw the favor of a particular god such as Jesus or Christian.
asdff 3y ago
Say you lived in the iron age in a little camp with your family. You see this really strangely dressed person commanding hundreds or thousands of people to listen to his every whim and demand. You might think he was a wizard or god too, being able to put so many under his spell, maybe you'd do wise to listen to him too lest you face the consequences of his fanatics.
mr_toad 3y ago
I’m sure at least some of them “believed” it when the alternative was being thrown to the lions.
huytersd 3y ago
It depends on what your definition of a god was. In India for example, you had gods that lived amongst the people and had minor supernatural capabilities. Ram was basically just a very capable leader with no special abilities and he’s venerated as a god. On the other hand you also has Brahma or Shiva who were more omnipotent and all powerful.

gleenn 3y ago

2100 years ago was before Christ and at least a few people think he's pretty important. Seems reasonable to assume there was enough mysticism that people would believe it.

qwerty456127 3y ago
> Seems reasonable to assume there was enough mysticism Is there a reason to believe ancient people had no skepticism and popularly took mysticism seriously?
- carbotaniuman 3y ago
  Even today there are people who have little skepticism and take mysticism seriously, it is likely that any evidence against this person did not survive the times.
  - qwerty456127 3y ago
    Indeed. Even today "there are people...". What I am curious about is how much does the average degree of seriousness differ between our and their times. We seemingly tend to assume people of the distant past predominantly were extremely naïve and sincerely believed whatever we find written by them. But what if they were almost as rational as modern people are and that's we who are naïve when reasoning about their beliefs?
    - Loughla 3y ago
      I think it's less about being naive and more about the base of information. I believe I need antibiotics when I have an appropriate infection, because modern medicine has built an entire catalogue of reasons. If we don't have that information, and we do have "experts" saying it's because our autumn sacrifice wasn't good enough, then my guess is that's what most people will believe. Make the best choice you can with the available information, sort of thing.
    - WalterBright 3y ago
      Modern people are driven by cognitive biases and emotion. They then attempt to justify these decisions after the fact with logical fallacies.
- skinner927 3y ago
  When a bad harvest, a pack of hungry wolves, violent neighbors, or a small cut that becomes infected, are all life threatening possibilities, I think mysticism overrules skepticism.
- AlotOfReading 3y ago
  People were skeptical then as well. What you're missing is that religion in the premodern world had political and cultural dimensions that are largely non-existent in modern Western society. Rejecting someone's divinity when the current political leader legitimizes their rule by descent from that person is also rejecting the current political leaders. That's could be quite a dangerous statement to make, so it's one you'll be relatively quiet about compared to the people writing mythical stories into official histories that survived to the present day.
  - qwerty456127 3y ago
    I'm not missing this. Quite contrary - this is exactly what I mean. Even today I would run around and yell our president is a superhero, maybe even pretend I mean that literally, if I somehow believed this could do real good and no harm and the president was doing a good job. Needless to say I would hardly believe he can see through walls and will fly to save me in case of an emergency.

anonymouskimmer 3y ago

It might just have been the name his parents gave him. In such cases it would just be an aspirational name such as Chastity, or one meant to draw the favor of a particular god such as Jesus or Christian.

asdff 3y ago

Say you lived in the iron age in a little camp with your family. You see this really strangely dressed person commanding hundreds or thousands of people to listen to his every whim and demand. You might think he was a wizard or god too, being able to put so many under his spell, maybe you'd do wise to listen to him too lest you face the consequences of his fanatics.

mr_toad 3y ago

I’m sure at least some of them “believed” it when the alternative was being thrown to the lions.

huytersd 3y ago

It depends on what your definition of a god was. In India for example, you had gods that lived amongst the people and had minor supernatural capabilities. Ram was basically just a very capable leader with no special abilities and he’s venerated as a god. On the other hand you also has Brahma or Shiva who were more omnipotent and all powerful.