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This reads as a press release I must say, anyone know how viable this is and what it produces as it exhaust gasses?

by prox 3y ago

evrimoztamur 3y ago
In the other ammonia conversion article the comments noted that the combustion is incomplete, but I assume then a closed circuit system could ‘distill’ the leftovers back into the tank and let out the NOx exhaust out (?)
- pgeorgi 3y ago
  NOx, the type of stuff that sparked Dieselgate? Great idea...
- dave4420 3y ago
  NOx is a greenhouse gas, isn’t it? Or have I got it confused with something else?
  - MrMan 3y ago
    [dead]
  - evrimoztamur 3y ago
    My bad, somebody else noted that the main product is N2 and not NOx, but I am not knowledgeable on this enough to point out the results. I was referring to https://nh3fuelassociation.org/2018/12/07/performance-of-ammonia-natural-gas-co-fired-gas-turbine-for-power-generation/ https://nh3fuelassociation.org/2018/12/07/performance-of-amm... which is specifically for co-firing on natgas turbines.
maweki 3y ago
Ideally by combustion with oxygen you get water and nitrogen. Which seems fine. Though ammonia is highly toxic and there's probably a lot of engineering involved to get this safe and efficient.
belter 3y ago
I think Toyota did not provide enough details on the work. They might have some great engineering done but needs to be seen. If this paper is to be trusted, for dual fuel engines benefits are minimal. "Nitro-compounds and GHG exhaust emissions of a pilot diesel-ignited ammonia dual-fuel engine under various operating conditions" - https://arxiv.org/abs/2307.03797# https://arxiv.org/abs/2307.03797# "...Unburned NH3 increases with raising ammonia content but decreases with increasing engine load and speed. The NO+NO2 tendency shows a non-linearity trend with increasing ammonia content, while a trade-off correlation is linked to N2O. The N2O emission of ammonia engine significantly weakens the beneficial effect of GHG reduction, the 30% and 50% decarbonization targets need at least 40% and 60% ammonia energy without regard to N2O effect, while at least 65% and 80% ammonia energy respectively with considering N2O. N2O presents a parabolic-like tendency with AERs. Advanced pilot-diesel injection timing helps to reduce both NH3 and N2O, but this effect becomes insignificant as the AER is less than 0.4..." On the positive side...Everybody will be laughing their way to their destination.( N2O )

This reads as a press release I must say, anyone know how viable this is and what it produces as it exhaust gasses?

by prox 3y ago

This reads as a press release I must say, anyone know how viable this is and what it produces as it exhaust gasses?

In the other ammonia conversion article the comments noted that the combustion is incomplete, but I assume then a closed circuit system could ‘distill’ the leftovers back into the tank and let out the NOx exhaust out (?)

pgeorgi 3y ago
NOx, the type of stuff that sparked Dieselgate? Great idea...
dave4420 3y ago
NOx is a greenhouse gas, isn’t it? Or have I got it confused with something else?
- MrMan 3y ago
  [dead]
- evrimoztamur 3y ago
  My bad, somebody else noted that the main product is N2 and not NOx, but I am not knowledgeable on this enough to point out the results. I was referring to https://nh3fuelassociation.org/2018/12/07/performance-of-ammonia-natural-gas-co-fired-gas-turbine-for-power-generation/ https://nh3fuelassociation.org/2018/12/07/performance-of-amm... which is specifically for co-firing on natgas turbines.

maweki 3y ago

Ideally by combustion with oxygen you get water and nitrogen. Which seems fine. Though ammonia is highly toxic and there's probably a lot of engineering involved to get this safe and efficient.

belter 3y ago

I think Toyota did not provide enough details on the work. They might have some great engineering done but needs to be seen. If this paper is to be trusted, for dual fuel engines benefits are minimal. "Nitro-compounds and GHG exhaust emissions of a pilot diesel-ignited ammonia dual-fuel engine under various operating conditions" - https://arxiv.org/abs/2307.03797# https://arxiv.org/abs/2307.03797# "...Unburned NH3 increases with raising ammonia content but decreases with increasing engine load and speed. The NO+NO2 tendency shows a non-linearity trend with increasing ammonia content, while a trade-off correlation is linked to N2O. The N2O emission of ammonia engine significantly weakens the beneficial effect of GHG reduction, the 30% and 50% decarbonization targets need at least 40% and 60% ammonia energy without regard to N2O effect, while at least 65% and 80% ammonia energy respectively with considering N2O. N2O presents a parabolic-like tendency with AERs. Advanced pilot-diesel injection timing helps to reduce both NH3 and N2O, but this effect becomes insignificant as the AER is less than 0.4..." On the positive side...Everybody will be laughing their way to their destination.( N2O )