5 ms·

I was worried from the very start of the WASM tech, that it would lead to the end of the user-controlled client. You don't even really need an embedded browser

by ta8645 3y ago

I was worried from the very start of the WASM tech, that it would lead to the end of the user-controlled client. You don't even really need an embedded browser, a motivated provider could create a completely proprietary protocol for rendering their pages.

EvanAnderson 3y ago
A browser is nice because the provider can continue to use their whole tech stack, hosting, dev tools, etc. Just wrap it in a proxy that only wants to talk to the "inner browser".
deleted 3y ago
[deleted]
thriftwy 3y ago
That you can do trivially even today. Just show your web site using in-browser VNC client.
- hot_gril 3y ago
  That's the final form. Kinda like video game streaming.
autoexec 3y ago
Taking power away from the user seems to be a large part of the appeal of WASM. Wasn't it just a year or two ago that it was being reported that 75% of WASM modules are malicious? A study from a previous year had said 50% of all websites using it were malicious so the trend line isn't looking great. I don't know how we got from "don't download and install random software from untrusted sources on your devices" to "let anyone with a website run code directly on your hardware. Sandboxes are impossible to breach!" I get that it's cool tech and the promise of writing software to run on many different platforms is exciting, but from a real world/user perspective it's insane.
- armchairhacker 3y ago
  > I don't know how we got from "don't download and install random software from untrusted sources on your devices" to "let anyone with a website run code directly on your hardware. Sandboxes are impossible to breech!" The whole point of WASM is that it's the alternative to downloading and installing random software.
  - nehal3m 3y ago
    Wasn’t that your parents point though?
  - autoexec 3y ago
    "Same malware, but with fewer steps" isn't exactly a win for WASM.
- minitech 3y ago
  It has exactly the same potential in the control and code-running respects as (minified) JavaScript. It’s overrepresented in malware because it’s faster, i.e. better for cryptominers. (Many sandbox breaches come from JavaScript’s complexity.)
  - pests 3y ago
    Right, did everyone forget about ASM.js? We already had conpile-to-js, it was just a horrible subset of more efficient JS. WASM is just the extension and further development of that.
danielheath 3y ago
I’d argue that “JS as a compilation target” already did everything WASM could do. It hasn’t been the end of the world, but it hasn’t been great either.

by ta8645 3y ago

EvanAnderson 3y ago

A browser is nice because the provider can continue to use their whole tech stack, hosting, dev tools, etc. Just wrap it in a proxy that only wants to talk to the "inner browser".

deleted 3y ago

[deleted]

thriftwy 3y ago

That you can do trivially even today. Just show your web site using in-browser VNC client.

hot_gril 3y ago
That's the final form. Kinda like video game streaming.

autoexec 3y ago

Taking power away from the user seems to be a large part of the appeal of WASM. Wasn't it just a year or two ago that it was being reported that 75% of WASM modules are malicious? A study from a previous year had said 50% of all websites using it were malicious so the trend line isn't looking great. I don't know how we got from "don't download and install random software from untrusted sources on your devices" to "let anyone with a website run code directly on your hardware. Sandboxes are impossible to breach!" I get that it's cool tech and the promise of writing software to run on many different platforms is exciting, but from a real world/user perspective it's insane.

armchairhacker 3y ago
> I don't know how we got from "don't download and install random software from untrusted sources on your devices" to "let anyone with a website run code directly on your hardware. Sandboxes are impossible to breech!" The whole point of WASM is that it's the alternative to downloading and installing random software.
- nehal3m 3y ago
  Wasn’t that your parents point though?
- autoexec 3y ago
  "Same malware, but with fewer steps" isn't exactly a win for WASM.
minitech 3y ago
It has exactly the same potential in the control and code-running respects as (minified) JavaScript. It’s overrepresented in malware because it’s faster, i.e. better for cryptominers. (Many sandbox breaches come from JavaScript’s complexity.)
- pests 3y ago
  Right, did everyone forget about ASM.js? We already had conpile-to-js, it was just a horrible subset of more efficient JS. WASM is just the extension and further development of that.

danielheath 3y ago

I’d argue that “JS as a compilation target” already did everything WASM could do. It hasn’t been the end of the world, but it hasn’t been great either.