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> I wish to point out that those who fly private airplanes (including those using leaded avgas) are the most likely to demand I stop driving my 23 year old pic

> I wish to point out that those who fly private airplanes (including those using leaded avgas) are the most likely to demand I stop driving my 23 year old pickup. Citation needed. Did you actually experience this, or is this a hypothetical? I do not know why pilots would be giving you a hard time with a truck given that most general aviation aircraft in operation are older than your truck. What I have seen is people driving brand new trucks calling all GA aircraft a 'rich person's toy' even when they cost much less than their shiny trucks. > banning all civilian air travel If we calculate fuel economy per mile, planes do pretty good for long trips. Planes are (obviously) very aerodynamic and light. Getting up to altitude takes a lot of fuel but, once there, they sip fuel. Mind you that there are general aviation planes running with standard gasoline that are most likely more efficient than a 23 year old trucks and, most likely, even more efficient than new trucks, once you consider the speed they travel at and how light and aerodynamic they are compared to a truck. And, since you said All civilian air travel, that includes airliners. Now we are talking efficiency per set per mile. The numbers are actually pretty good; you can look them up. All that said, can we, collectively, stop antagonizing people that live a different lifestyle than we do, for no reason?

samtho 3y ago
> I do not know why pilots would be giving you a hard time with a truck given that most general aviation aircraft in operation are older than your truck. The airframe likely is older than the truck, but the engine is usually considerably newer. GA aircraft engines require overhauls or replacement be done every 1200-2000 hours of run time.
- mrguyorama 3y ago
  Overhauling an engine every 2000 hours does not change that it is a 1960s design which relies on a very rich mixture and stupidly high octane fuels to not blow itself up to make what would today be very mediocre performance figures. Rotax has some newer designs that are fuel injected, have modern piston head designs, and sometimes have turbochargers, and those represent what a "new" aircraft engine looks like.
  - samtho 3y ago
    While this is true, the frequency and ease in which engines are swapped does allow the potential for innovation to creep into the space. We’ve made ICE engines smaller and more efficient over the last 3/4 of a century - but the FAA doesn’t seem to car about GA and likely won’t let anything innovative into non-experimental aircraft, which is a shame. Their argument is always safety, but we have ways to test for that and most of the GA engine designs we still see are from an era where they were not as concerned and were effectively grandfathered in.
RecycledEle 3y ago
>> I wish to point out that those who fly private airplanes (including those using leaded avgas) are the most likely to demand I stop driving my 23 year old pickup. > Citation needed. Did you actually experience this, or is this a hypothetical? https://www.forbes.com/sites/michaelshellenberger/2019/08/20/the-real-reason-they-behave-hypocritically-on-climate-change-is-because-they-want-to/?sh=6444d474185a https://www.forbes.com/sites/michaelshellenberger/2019/08/20... https://www.investors.com/politics/commentary/global-warming-hypocrites-their-carbon-footprint-is-ok-but-yours-must-be-eliminated/ https://www.investors.com/politics/commentary/global-warming... https://www.investors.com/politics/editorials/climate-change-true-believers-are-least-likely-to-change-their-own-behavior-study-finds/ https://www.investors.com/politics/editorials/climate-change... https://www.telegraph.co.uk/columnists/2021/09/26/sick-do-as-i-say-not-as-i-do-eco-hypocrites-telling-live-life/ https://www.telegraph.co.uk/columnists/2021/09/26/sick-do-as... > All that said, can we, collectively, stop antagonizing people that live a different lifestyle than we do, for no reason? That's up to those who fly and demand I stop driving.

samtho 3y ago

> I do not know why pilots would be giving you a hard time with a truck given that most general aviation aircraft in operation are older than your truck. The airframe likely is older than the truck, but the engine is usually considerably newer. GA aircraft engines require overhauls or replacement be done every 1200-2000 hours of run time.

mrguyorama 3y ago
Overhauling an engine every 2000 hours does not change that it is a 1960s design which relies on a very rich mixture and stupidly high octane fuels to not blow itself up to make what would today be very mediocre performance figures. Rotax has some newer designs that are fuel injected, have modern piston head designs, and sometimes have turbochargers, and those represent what a "new" aircraft engine looks like.
- samtho 3y ago
  While this is true, the frequency and ease in which engines are swapped does allow the potential for innovation to creep into the space. We’ve made ICE engines smaller and more efficient over the last 3/4 of a century - but the FAA doesn’t seem to car about GA and likely won’t let anything innovative into non-experimental aircraft, which is a shame. Their argument is always safety, but we have ways to test for that and most of the GA engine designs we still see are from an era where they were not as concerned and were effectively grandfathered in.

RecycledEle 3y ago

>> I wish to point out that those who fly private airplanes (including those using leaded avgas) are the most likely to demand I stop driving my 23 year old pickup. > Citation needed. Did you actually experience this, or is this a hypothetical? https://www.forbes.com/sites/michaelshellenberger/2019/08/20/the-real-reason-they-behave-hypocritically-on-climate-change-is-because-they-want-to/?sh=6444d474185a https://www.forbes.com/sites/michaelshellenberger/2019/08/20... https://www.investors.com/politics/commentary/global-warming-hypocrites-their-carbon-footprint-is-ok-but-yours-must-be-eliminated/ https://www.investors.com/politics/commentary/global-warming... https://www.investors.com/politics/editorials/climate-change-true-believers-are-least-likely-to-change-their-own-behavior-study-finds/ https://www.investors.com/politics/editorials/climate-change... https://www.telegraph.co.uk/columnists/2021/09/26/sick-do-as-i-say-not-as-i-do-eco-hypocrites-telling-live-life/ https://www.telegraph.co.uk/columnists/2021/09/26/sick-do-as... > All that said, can we, collectively, stop antagonizing people that live a different lifestyle than we do, for no reason? That's up to those who fly and demand I stop driving.