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This gave me a proper chuckle. Truly though I think movies like The Terminator and The Matrix really did a number on the societal consciousness and capacity to

This gave me a proper chuckle. Truly though I think movies like The Terminator and The Matrix really did a number on the societal consciousness and capacity to think clearly when it comes to anything called "AI".

TaylorAlexander 3y ago
As a robotics engineer and someone who was interested in robotics since I was 11 years old, and I am SO VERY TIRED of people making the "haha they will kill us all" jokes. It's just the only thing that 99% of people can think about when it comes to robotics and AI! The Terminator came out the year I was born, 39 years ago, and it seems to be all people can think about to this day. When some powerful and wealthy person controls an AI algorithm that could manipulate the masses, all the people can think about is "oh no the algorithm will become sentient and take over". I am MUCH more worried about the actual people at the helm who will definitely use these things to harm society, not the completely theoretical fantasy that the algorithm itself will become self aware and do us harm. So I completely agree with you. I see this constantly and it is just a completely thought-terminating cliche and a "joke" which is four decades old at this point.
- startupsfail 3y ago
  If you’ve been around for a while, then you should remember that the current state of affairs, where an AI could chat and generate code is relatively recent - Unreasonable Effectiveness paper came out only in 2015. And Deep Learning was there only from 2010. With just a few people who were working on it, instead of using discriminative models. These same people (I belong to that group), who had a vision back then, to work on a right thing, are now saying clearly that super intelligent machines are nearly there. And likely this is a potential change and a challenge, as we’ve seen many examples when superior intelligence doesn’t care that much about inferior. As to “become self aware” - it’s super simple to SFT a model that is “self aware”. There is nothing magical in self awareness. There is also not much use in it, so no one is bothering to do it.
  - RandomLensman 3y ago
    It's fair to say "we believe X will happen soon", but if the dangerous super intelligent machines don't happen any time soon, will those same people compensate societies for wasting political and economic resources on worrying about it? The view of a rather imminent danger has real consequences even if it turns out incorrect.
    - NoThankYouTho 3y ago
      I personally believe that there are real silver linings to this. It's anecdotal, but I've seen people who don't normally reflect on their lives actually start to contextualize their role as workers, even if through fear of disruption. Pointing out that it's not inherently AI's fault, more the way we've constructed our society - that the underlying goal is not to sustainably maximize wellbeing but to maximize wealth created (which leads to no safety net to keep the labor pool large and incentivizes the creation of AI to replace people cheaply) - is as important as dispelling "sci-fi self-awareness and autonomy" fears when talking about AI. And there have been much stupider "public discourse" fads. They're not going anywhere and I'll take what I can get, honestly.
  - TaylorAlexander 3y ago
    I am not sure I understand exactly what you are trying to argue so I will re-state my concerns. I am more concerned with the human beings using super intelligent algorithms to manipulate people than I am about the algorithms taking on a mind of their own and manipulating us with their own internally generated desires and out-of-control behaviors. But the trope I run in to is people spending all their time talking about the latter, which only serves to shield the former from further scrutiny. Also I am using fantasy in the narrow sense, meaning something that has not yet occurred which we are imagining. Super intelligence is likely to occur I think, but super intelligence which is beyond our control is much more speculative. Meanwhile powerful people using technology to manipulate people is a story as old as time.
two_in_one 3y ago
Just like clowns became evil thanks to Hollywood. Couple of years ago every celebrity, <long list here>, thought they must warn us about the danger of AI.

TaylorAlexander 3y ago

As a robotics engineer and someone who was interested in robotics since I was 11 years old, and I am SO VERY TIRED of people making the "haha they will kill us all" jokes. It's just the only thing that 99% of people can think about when it comes to robotics and AI! The Terminator came out the year I was born, 39 years ago, and it seems to be all people can think about to this day. When some powerful and wealthy person controls an AI algorithm that could manipulate the masses, all the people can think about is "oh no the algorithm will become sentient and take over". I am MUCH more worried about the actual people at the helm who will definitely use these things to harm society, not the completely theoretical fantasy that the algorithm itself will become self aware and do us harm. So I completely agree with you. I see this constantly and it is just a completely thought-terminating cliche and a "joke" which is four decades old at this point.

startupsfail 3y ago
If you’ve been around for a while, then you should remember that the current state of affairs, where an AI could chat and generate code is relatively recent - Unreasonable Effectiveness paper came out only in 2015. And Deep Learning was there only from 2010. With just a few people who were working on it, instead of using discriminative models. These same people (I belong to that group), who had a vision back then, to work on a right thing, are now saying clearly that super intelligent machines are nearly there. And likely this is a potential change and a challenge, as we’ve seen many examples when superior intelligence doesn’t care that much about inferior. As to “become self aware” - it’s super simple to SFT a model that is “self aware”. There is nothing magical in self awareness. There is also not much use in it, so no one is bothering to do it.
- RandomLensman 3y ago
  It's fair to say "we believe X will happen soon", but if the dangerous super intelligent machines don't happen any time soon, will those same people compensate societies for wasting political and economic resources on worrying about it? The view of a rather imminent danger has real consequences even if it turns out incorrect.
  - NoThankYouTho 3y ago
    I personally believe that there are real silver linings to this. It's anecdotal, but I've seen people who don't normally reflect on their lives actually start to contextualize their role as workers, even if through fear of disruption. Pointing out that it's not inherently AI's fault, more the way we've constructed our society - that the underlying goal is not to sustainably maximize wellbeing but to maximize wealth created (which leads to no safety net to keep the labor pool large and incentivizes the creation of AI to replace people cheaply) - is as important as dispelling "sci-fi self-awareness and autonomy" fears when talking about AI. And there have been much stupider "public discourse" fads. They're not going anywhere and I'll take what I can get, honestly.
- TaylorAlexander 3y ago
  I am not sure I understand exactly what you are trying to argue so I will re-state my concerns. I am more concerned with the human beings using super intelligent algorithms to manipulate people than I am about the algorithms taking on a mind of their own and manipulating us with their own internally generated desires and out-of-control behaviors. But the trope I run in to is people spending all their time talking about the latter, which only serves to shield the former from further scrutiny. Also I am using fantasy in the narrow sense, meaning something that has not yet occurred which we are imagining. Super intelligence is likely to occur I think, but super intelligence which is beyond our control is much more speculative. Meanwhile powerful people using technology to manipulate people is a story as old as time.

two_in_one 3y ago

Just like clowns became evil thanks to Hollywood. Couple of years ago every celebrity, <long list here>, thought they must warn us about the danger of AI.