6 ms·

I will fully concede that the trend of game makers releasing half-baked, poorly optimized games that are buggy and unplayable at launch is totally a thing and i

I will fully concede that the trend of game makers releasing half-baked, poorly optimized games that are buggy and unplayable at launch is totally a thing and it is frustrating and we should demand better (though we keep buying so why would they stop?). BUT.... the online game community is so insufferable and this Cities Skylines II launch is a great example of it. The game is not about 4k 120 fps gameplay. It is a simulation game that runs fairly well even on last gen's hardware if you drop SOME of the fidelity settings. But that's not the predominant discourse. If people can't play it at 4k out of the box on their overpriced 4090 then they take straight to the internet to complain (and mind you they have tried fiddling with exactly 0 knobs to make it runnable). I am by no means making excuses for game makers who certainly share much of the blame for creating an environment of distrust among game fans. But the online discourse is just rage baiting and looking for anything to hate with minimal evidence or sometimes even outright lies. Makes me want to go into a cave and play my games without seeing any content or discussion about it.

gymbeaux 3y ago
It’s an interesting notion that we are forced into buying better, newer hardware, more often, because of “capitalism”. It’s an interesting thought that, given the perfect software, one might run Fallout 4 on a Radeon HD 5750 or Cities Skylines on a Pentium 4.
wackget 3y ago
> If people can't play it at 4k out of the box on their overpriced 4090 then they take straight to the internet to complain (and mind you they have tried fiddling with exactly 0 knobs to make it runnable). The top comment contains this extract from an IGN review: > I have a 13900k, 64GB of RAM, and a RTX 4090, playing on a 1440p ultrawide monitor. I got 35fps at the main menu and in game on a brand new map w/o building a single thing. Turning off motion blur and depth field increased this from 35 to 50fps. Not a single other graphics setting changed the performance at all. I turned off every single setting I could or set it to the lowest possible, and still only got 50fps.
- ptasci67 3y ago
  Yes, I was addressing the broader discourse more generally, specifically Reddit. But you're right that the article did directly address this though I would say the tone and title of the article are incongruous with the simple fact that they were able to get the game to run well with minor tweaks. I take issue with "only got 50fps". This is not Counter Strike or a game that demands 300fps. 50fps (if your 1% lows are within reason) is completely playable.
  - fluoridation 3y ago
    It's not about the number by itself, it's what the number implies. If an RTX 4090 can't get to 60 FPS on an empty map, what will happen when the game is running on an RTX 4060 and it has to render a complete city? >I take issue with "only got 50fps". This is not Counter Strike or a game that demands 300fps. 50fps (if your 1% lows are within reason) is completely playable. You're complaining about people complaining. If you're satisfied with the game being playable then play it, but others may have different expectations of quality, and it's not wrong for them to voice their opinion when the product they paid money for doesn't meet them. I personally don't remember participating in a congress of gamers where everyone agreed not to complain about a game unless it was practically unplayable.
    - Kuxe 3y ago
      >If you're satisfied with the game being playable then play it, but others may have different expectations of quality, and it's not wrong for them to voice their opinion when the product they paid money for doesn't meet them. I'm all for voicing opinions in a civic and calm manner. Most people online voicing their opinions come off as know-it-all teens or children throwing tantrums. It's as-if they have a _right_ to a CS2 with 120fps. Paradox warned about bad performance prior to launch (https://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/threads/updates-on-modding-and-performance-for-cities-skylines-ii.1601865/ https://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/threads/updates-on-modd...). Nobody claimed or said performance was gonna be great. And still, people act surprised. It's no surprise that the reviews was down at close to 30% a couple of hours into the release and today at 52%. Why is there such a massive bias towards large reviews at the first hours? Because many gamers loves thrashing about. It's much more important than taking a step down and calming down.
mbwgh 3y ago
It's predominantly people with strong opionions who actively partake in online communities (instead of just lurking), so the vitriol is to be expected.
rldjbpin 3y ago
this take is not fair to the community. almost all games auto set graphics settings as per your hardware since many years now. any good developer would test these configurations on common hardware combinations (at least on the popular GPUs) before shipping. other than maybe the graphics preset, why are we expected to change all the dials just to start the game from the menu? in the crossplatform era, PC has been treated as second class citizen with optimization. forza motorsport is also another example where even having above their minimum requirements give a slideshow on launch, despite lowering all settings. expecting every gamer on PC to be tinkerers is just a myopic take that does not help with development priorities.

gymbeaux 3y ago

It’s an interesting notion that we are forced into buying better, newer hardware, more often, because of “capitalism”. It’s an interesting thought that, given the perfect software, one might run Fallout 4 on a Radeon HD 5750 or Cities Skylines on a Pentium 4.

wackget 3y ago

> If people can't play it at 4k out of the box on their overpriced 4090 then they take straight to the internet to complain (and mind you they have tried fiddling with exactly 0 knobs to make it runnable). The top comment contains this extract from an IGN review: > I have a 13900k, 64GB of RAM, and a RTX 4090, playing on a 1440p ultrawide monitor. I got 35fps at the main menu and in game on a brand new map w/o building a single thing. Turning off motion blur and depth field increased this from 35 to 50fps. Not a single other graphics setting changed the performance at all. I turned off every single setting I could or set it to the lowest possible, and still only got 50fps.

ptasci67 3y ago
Yes, I was addressing the broader discourse more generally, specifically Reddit. But you're right that the article did directly address this though I would say the tone and title of the article are incongruous with the simple fact that they were able to get the game to run well with minor tweaks. I take issue with "only got 50fps". This is not Counter Strike or a game that demands 300fps. 50fps (if your 1% lows are within reason) is completely playable.
- fluoridation 3y ago
  It's not about the number by itself, it's what the number implies. If an RTX 4090 can't get to 60 FPS on an empty map, what will happen when the game is running on an RTX 4060 and it has to render a complete city? >I take issue with "only got 50fps". This is not Counter Strike or a game that demands 300fps. 50fps (if your 1% lows are within reason) is completely playable. You're complaining about people complaining. If you're satisfied with the game being playable then play it, but others may have different expectations of quality, and it's not wrong for them to voice their opinion when the product they paid money for doesn't meet them. I personally don't remember participating in a congress of gamers where everyone agreed not to complain about a game unless it was practically unplayable.
  - Kuxe 3y ago
    >If you're satisfied with the game being playable then play it, but others may have different expectations of quality, and it's not wrong for them to voice their opinion when the product they paid money for doesn't meet them. I'm all for voicing opinions in a civic and calm manner. Most people online voicing their opinions come off as know-it-all teens or children throwing tantrums. It's as-if they have a _right_ to a CS2 with 120fps. Paradox warned about bad performance prior to launch (https://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/threads/updates-on-modding-and-performance-for-cities-skylines-ii.1601865/ https://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/threads/updates-on-modd...). Nobody claimed or said performance was gonna be great. And still, people act surprised. It's no surprise that the reviews was down at close to 30% a couple of hours into the release and today at 52%. Why is there such a massive bias towards large reviews at the first hours? Because many gamers loves thrashing about. It's much more important than taking a step down and calming down.

mbwgh 3y ago

It's predominantly people with strong opionions who actively partake in online communities (instead of just lurking), so the vitriol is to be expected.

rldjbpin 3y ago

this take is not fair to the community. almost all games auto set graphics settings as per your hardware since many years now. any good developer would test these configurations on common hardware combinations (at least on the popular GPUs) before shipping. other than maybe the graphics preset, why are we expected to change all the dials just to start the game from the menu? in the crossplatform era, PC has been treated as second class citizen with optimization. forza motorsport is also another example where even having above their minimum requirements give a slideshow on launch, despite lowering all settings. expecting every gamer on PC to be tinkerers is just a myopic take that does not help with development priorities.