4 ms·

You make very good points and I personally agree with you fundamentally, however your example is a bit exaggerated: there are very few jobs where just "working

You make very good points and I personally agree with you fundamentally, however your example is a bit exaggerated: there are very few jobs where just "working harder" will lead to a 10× jump in compensation. Making 600K$pa would put someone in the top 1% of earners in the US, obviously not something generalizable to the entire population. I do agree one must stay on the lookout for opportunities where working harder is rewarded, and also that one should try finding some joy in work. But also that one must stay realistic in their expectations, and that much joy is to be found outside of work (relationships, hobbies, discovery, leisure, etc).

JusticeJuice 3y ago
Yeah. You don't get paid for hard work, you get paid for experience applied to lucrative problems.
- sangnoir 3y ago
  IMO, you don't get paid for experience either. You get paid the minimum amount your employer thinks they can get away with without you leaving, capped at some fraction of the value you add,(less overheads, risks, etc).
- orochimaaru 3y ago
  Actually you get paid and promoted for making your vp and csuite earn brownie points.
  - __xor_eax_eax 3y ago
    Thats where the experience comes in
  - nostrademons 3y ago
    ...which is the "applied to lucrative problems" part. VPs and C-suites get brownie points by making money.
    - orochimaaru 3y ago
      Not always. It could be for starting new lines of business or just plan political wrangling. May even be something that loses the company money.
- uberduper 3y ago
  It's common for performance based RSU grants to stack up to this sort of total comp over a few years.
brightball 3y ago
My first job out of college was at a telco making $72k / year. I worked my tail off. Worked late. Never missed deadlines. Signed on after hours. Learned a lot. Followed process. Took lots of pride in my work. And I got a lot better at what I do. When 2 members of my 3 person team departed and all of the work fell to me, I asked for a raise to $90k. Seemed reasonable to me taking on the work of 3 people given my track record. I was told that wasn’t possible. So I interviewed elsewhere with my updated resume and turned in my notice. Within a day of turning in my notice I got a counter offer. Apparently, one of the corporate policies at this telco was to only offer significant raises for retention purposes if the employee had another offer. Which was nuts but apparently the only way to find out if you were valued was to interview elsewhere. At that point, I was so annoyed that I decided to leave anyway…to another job where I worked long hours and was on call. But I learned a lot. The hard work paid off and I haven’t actually had to interview for a job in about 15 years. This is what I think about when I hear people talk about not putting in the extra time. If I’d done that, done only the job exactly according to minimum expectations I would have collected a paycheck…and probably been stuck in the same place.
- itsoktocry 3y ago
  >Apparently, one of the corporate policies at this telco was to only offer significant raises for retention purposes if the employee had another offer. Yes, and I'm not sure if I feel completely negative about it. On the one hand, just pay up if the value is there, don't play games, right? On the other, the employer is "calling your bluff" about it being, more or less, about money alone. In the end, the policy works, I think.
  - brightball 3y ago
    Yep. The older I get, the more I understand it too.
  - zmgsabst 3y ago
    I consider it a red flag when employers take antagonistic positions, such as “calling my bluff”. That shows a clear level of disrespect and willingness to play games with my life — and is the sort of outcome one should expect if you allow departments like HR to engage in dark triad behaviors inside the company. HR treating employees like cattle to exploit is a Day 2 failure mode.

JusticeJuice 3y ago

Yeah. You don't get paid for hard work, you get paid for experience applied to lucrative problems.

sangnoir 3y ago
IMO, you don't get paid for experience either. You get paid the minimum amount your employer thinks they can get away with without you leaving, capped at some fraction of the value you add,(less overheads, risks, etc).
orochimaaru 3y ago
Actually you get paid and promoted for making your vp and csuite earn brownie points.
- __xor_eax_eax 3y ago
  Thats where the experience comes in
- nostrademons 3y ago
  ...which is the "applied to lucrative problems" part. VPs and C-suites get brownie points by making money.
  - orochimaaru 3y ago
    Not always. It could be for starting new lines of business or just plan political wrangling. May even be something that loses the company money.
uberduper 3y ago
It's common for performance based RSU grants to stack up to this sort of total comp over a few years.

brightball 3y ago

My first job out of college was at a telco making $72k / year. I worked my tail off. Worked late. Never missed deadlines. Signed on after hours. Learned a lot. Followed process. Took lots of pride in my work. And I got a lot better at what I do. When 2 members of my 3 person team departed and all of the work fell to me, I asked for a raise to $90k. Seemed reasonable to me taking on the work of 3 people given my track record. I was told that wasn’t possible. So I interviewed elsewhere with my updated resume and turned in my notice. Within a day of turning in my notice I got a counter offer. Apparently, one of the corporate policies at this telco was to only offer significant raises for retention purposes if the employee had another offer. Which was nuts but apparently the only way to find out if you were valued was to interview elsewhere. At that point, I was so annoyed that I decided to leave anyway…to another job where I worked long hours and was on call. But I learned a lot. The hard work paid off and I haven’t actually had to interview for a job in about 15 years. This is what I think about when I hear people talk about not putting in the extra time. If I’d done that, done only the job exactly according to minimum expectations I would have collected a paycheck…and probably been stuck in the same place.

itsoktocry 3y ago
>Apparently, one of the corporate policies at this telco was to only offer significant raises for retention purposes if the employee had another offer. Yes, and I'm not sure if I feel completely negative about it. On the one hand, just pay up if the value is there, don't play games, right? On the other, the employer is "calling your bluff" about it being, more or less, about money alone. In the end, the policy works, I think.
- brightball 3y ago
  Yep. The older I get, the more I understand it too.
- zmgsabst 3y ago
  I consider it a red flag when employers take antagonistic positions, such as “calling my bluff”. That shows a clear level of disrespect and willingness to play games with my life — and is the sort of outcome one should expect if you allow departments like HR to engage in dark triad behaviors inside the company. HR treating employees like cattle to exploit is a Day 2 failure mode.