4 ms·

It is a fairly typical size for a townhouse build in the early 1900s, for example. Sometimes they are chopped up into apartments these days. If you are looking

It is a fairly typical size for a townhouse build in the early 1900s, for example. Sometimes they are chopped up into apartments these days. If you are looking in Germany, some cities have more of them, some less (bit dependent on bomb damages and industrial history, I'd say).

ben_w 3y ago
When properties are chopped up into n apartments, they should be counted as n separate properties. I've just looked at the search results for immobilienscout24.de for Germany-wide "houses" for sale — scare-quotes because based on my other searches, quite a lot turned out to be apartments (individual or the whole building[1]) or hotels[2] — out of a total of 164,772 properties only 12,759 were at least 300 m^2, or 7.7%. Even eight percent cannot possibly be counted as "typical". Of course, it is possible that the people entering info into immobilienscout24 are regularly not paying attention, as this "one room" property with "19 apartments" and "52 garages" suggests: https://www.immobilienscout24.de/expose/146925779?referrer=RESULT_LIST_LISTING&searchId=404d4d02-2fbc-3241-ae56-4e6a9deaa48a&searchType=district#/ https://www.immobilienscout24.de/expose/146925779?referrer=R... [1] https://www.immobilienscout24.de/expose/143407389?referrer=RESULT_LIST_LISTING&searchId=efc9ec8f-48b5-3fb1-b757-ee77d01b1c22&searchType=district#/ https://www.immobilienscout24.de/expose/143407389?referrer=R... [2] https://www.immobilienscout24.de/expose/147035140?referrer=RESULT_LIST_LISTING&searchId=efc9ec8f-48b5-3fb1-b757-ee77d01b1c22&searchType=district#/ https://www.immobilienscout24.de/expose/147035140?referrer=R...
- RandomLensman 3y ago
  It is typical for the kind of building I described and they tend not to be on the market much, so not sure how representative your search really is. Entire streets are full of them. Anyway, even a smaller place clocking in at "only" 100k to get to a higher energy efficiency is a lot of money for some retired person, for example (and lending guidelines don't favor old people).
  - ben_w 3y ago
    If the category members don't go on the market in the first place, it was already a stranded asset, this state isn't being newly set due to hypothetical future regulations.
    - RandomLensman 3y ago
      Sorry, no, this things sell well, but usually not much over platforms. They would become tough for some in case of regulation. It's besides the point anyway, as I was talking about forcing people into difficult to finance things, give up on the place, or distressed selling. Whether that is 100k or 50k or 500k that causes that doesn't really matter at that point.
      - ben_w 3y ago
        > Sorry, no, this things sell well, but usually not much over platforms. They would become tough for some in case of regulation. Ok, I can see that as a possibility, though not one I could either confirm or refute so I'm still uncomfortable with it. > It's besides the point anyway, as I was talking about forcing people into difficult to finance things, give up on the place, or distressed selling. Whether that is 100k or 50k or 500k that causes that doesn't really matter at that point. Echt? To my understanding, a stranded asset is one that cannot be sold for a positive number. Surely if the cost is significantly smaller than the thing — and I'd expect that if you've got a building that could be mistaken for the apartment building I'm in due to its size, it's valuation is in the millions of euros — then it's still not stranded. For example, if it costs 300k to fix the whole building, but the whole building is valued at 3M — why wouldn't banks be willing to loan that for the improvements to allow it to be sold?

ben_w 3y ago

When properties are chopped up into n apartments, they should be counted as n separate properties. I've just looked at the search results for immobilienscout24.de for Germany-wide "houses" for sale — scare-quotes because based on my other searches, quite a lot turned out to be apartments (individual or the whole building[1]) or hotels[2] — out of a total of 164,772 properties only 12,759 were at least 300 m^2, or 7.7%. Even eight percent cannot possibly be counted as "typical". Of course, it is possible that the people entering info into immobilienscout24 are regularly not paying attention, as this "one room" property with "19 apartments" and "52 garages" suggests: https://www.immobilienscout24.de/expose/146925779?referrer=RESULT_LIST_LISTING&searchId=404d4d02-2fbc-3241-ae56-4e6a9deaa48a&searchType=district#/ https://www.immobilienscout24.de/expose/146925779?referrer=R... [1] https://www.immobilienscout24.de/expose/143407389?referrer=RESULT_LIST_LISTING&searchId=efc9ec8f-48b5-3fb1-b757-ee77d01b1c22&searchType=district#/ https://www.immobilienscout24.de/expose/143407389?referrer=R... [2] https://www.immobilienscout24.de/expose/147035140?referrer=RESULT_LIST_LISTING&searchId=efc9ec8f-48b5-3fb1-b757-ee77d01b1c22&searchType=district#/ https://www.immobilienscout24.de/expose/147035140?referrer=R...

RandomLensman 3y ago
It is typical for the kind of building I described and they tend not to be on the market much, so not sure how representative your search really is. Entire streets are full of them. Anyway, even a smaller place clocking in at "only" 100k to get to a higher energy efficiency is a lot of money for some retired person, for example (and lending guidelines don't favor old people).
- ben_w 3y ago
  If the category members don't go on the market in the first place, it was already a stranded asset, this state isn't being newly set due to hypothetical future regulations.
  - RandomLensman 3y ago
    Sorry, no, this things sell well, but usually not much over platforms. They would become tough for some in case of regulation. It's besides the point anyway, as I was talking about forcing people into difficult to finance things, give up on the place, or distressed selling. Whether that is 100k or 50k or 500k that causes that doesn't really matter at that point.
    - ben_w 3y ago
      > Sorry, no, this things sell well, but usually not much over platforms. They would become tough for some in case of regulation. Ok, I can see that as a possibility, though not one I could either confirm or refute so I'm still uncomfortable with it. > It's besides the point anyway, as I was talking about forcing people into difficult to finance things, give up on the place, or distressed selling. Whether that is 100k or 50k or 500k that causes that doesn't really matter at that point. Echt? To my understanding, a stranded asset is one that cannot be sold for a positive number. Surely if the cost is significantly smaller than the thing — and I'd expect that if you've got a building that could be mistaken for the apartment building I'm in due to its size, it's valuation is in the millions of euros — then it's still not stranded. For example, if it costs 300k to fix the whole building, but the whole building is valued at 3M — why wouldn't banks be willing to loan that for the improvements to allow it to be sold?