4 ms·

It's a quirky story, but I wonder if there are any human-life examples. Like getting invited to a special meeting where everyone gets donuts and coffee, then g

by 13of40 3y ago

It's a quirky story, but I wonder if there are any human-life examples. Like getting invited to a special meeting where everyone gets donuts and coffee, then gets laid off?

onetimeuse92304 3y ago
Sure. Sometimes instigators are seeded throughout a crowd (especially crowd of protesters) to get them to shout certain things or steer the protest in a certain way/direction. Humans also have vestiges of herd behaviour. For example, if one person decides to cross the intersection on a red light (especially pedestrian) then more people are likely to follow even if they would wait for green light otherwise.
- fifticon 3y ago
  the term for them is 'agent provocateur'.
  - boffinAudio 3y ago
    See also: MK ULTRA.
- verisimi 3y ago
  "vestiges" lol Going along with the crowd is foundational to being human - individuality doesn't come naturally.
explaininjs 3y ago
Social media influencers who are paid to lead crows to buy products/services by acting like they are customers, despite never spending money themselves come to mind.
- 13of40 3y ago
  One important point is that the judas goat doesn't know they're a judas goat, so as long the influencer just thinks they're living a rockin' life, but they were put in that position by someone who really knows what's going on, then I think this works.
  - Obscurity4340 3y ago
    [flagged]
  - thih9 3y ago
    > One important point is that the judas goat doesn't know they're a judas goat They likely don’t grasp the causality but I guess after 4-5 trips like this they know it’s not going to be an afternoon stroll for anyone other than themselves. Makes me think of someone who actually benefits from a MLM scheme and gets to interact with others who don’t. In a way also an influencer, but of a different kind than the social media one.
3seashells 3y ago
There are. During the holocaust, nazis are rumored to have used community elders that there kids would be spared.
- slim 3y ago
  this is the most disgusting thing you can do to a human being. worse than gas chambers
- Cthulhu_ 3y ago
  Betrayal was rife during WW2, it was a time where you couldn't trust anyone anymore. There's multiple stories about that in Maus, where people betray their own people and family to gain favors with the Nazis (there's some essays about that if you can't be bothered to read the graphic novel, e.g. here https://brandeis.digication.com/rkoehler/conflict https://brandeis.digication.com/rkoehler/conflict ). That is, the Nazis gave a Judas some food and other favors if they could find and report jews in hiding.
- optimalsolver 3y ago
  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kapo https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kapo
  - picadores 3y ago
    Its a horror in a different way. Because after this - your society is dead. The children may recover the innosence, but can you thrust any adult of your group ever again after that? Its the same effect that the survivor of mao, stalin and the likes share. You just know to much about humanity and the other to ever trust them again.
- motohagiography 3y ago
  Specifically, from the U.S. Holocaust museum, https://encyclopedia.ushmm.org/content/en/article/jewish-councils-judenraete https://encyclopedia.ushmm.org/content/en/article/jewish-cou... . I recently read the Eichmann trial coverage by Arendt, and she goes into this horrible situation in some depth. Getting people to betray and persecute each other for your benefit is probably the most essential definition of evil we have.
quickthrower2 3y ago
Drug dealers working with police for a reduced sentence. Spys?
Gustomaximus 3y ago
Look for examples of the useful idiot. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Useful_idiot https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Useful_idiot
Cthulhu_ 3y ago
I'm thinking of union busting infiltrators that point out the organizers to management so they get fired.
867-5309 3y ago
attending a gathering because they said they had a chicken and being expected to interact
octokatt 3y ago
I swear start-ups try to hire for Judas Goats as often as possible, normalizing long hours and "giving your all".

by 13of40 3y ago

It's a quirky story, but I wonder if there are any human-life examples. Like getting invited to a special meeting where everyone gets donuts and coffee, then gets laid off?

onetimeuse92304 3y ago

Sure. Sometimes instigators are seeded throughout a crowd (especially crowd of protesters) to get them to shout certain things or steer the protest in a certain way/direction. Humans also have vestiges of herd behaviour. For example, if one person decides to cross the intersection on a red light (especially pedestrian) then more people are likely to follow even if they would wait for green light otherwise.

fifticon 3y ago
the term for them is 'agent provocateur'.
- boffinAudio 3y ago
  See also: MK ULTRA.
verisimi 3y ago
"vestiges" lol Going along with the crowd is foundational to being human - individuality doesn't come naturally.

explaininjs 3y ago

Social media influencers who are paid to lead crows to buy products/services by acting like they are customers, despite never spending money themselves come to mind.

13of40 3y ago
One important point is that the judas goat doesn't know they're a judas goat, so as long the influencer just thinks they're living a rockin' life, but they were put in that position by someone who really knows what's going on, then I think this works.
- Obscurity4340 3y ago
  [flagged]
- thih9 3y ago
  > One important point is that the judas goat doesn't know they're a judas goat They likely don’t grasp the causality but I guess after 4-5 trips like this they know it’s not going to be an afternoon stroll for anyone other than themselves. Makes me think of someone who actually benefits from a MLM scheme and gets to interact with others who don’t. In a way also an influencer, but of a different kind than the social media one.

3seashells 3y ago

There are. During the holocaust, nazis are rumored to have used community elders that there kids would be spared.

slim 3y ago
this is the most disgusting thing you can do to a human being. worse than gas chambers
Cthulhu_ 3y ago
Betrayal was rife during WW2, it was a time where you couldn't trust anyone anymore. There's multiple stories about that in Maus, where people betray their own people and family to gain favors with the Nazis (there's some essays about that if you can't be bothered to read the graphic novel, e.g. here https://brandeis.digication.com/rkoehler/conflict https://brandeis.digication.com/rkoehler/conflict ). That is, the Nazis gave a Judas some food and other favors if they could find and report jews in hiding.
optimalsolver 3y ago
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kapo https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kapo
- picadores 3y ago
  Its a horror in a different way. Because after this - your society is dead. The children may recover the innosence, but can you thrust any adult of your group ever again after that? Its the same effect that the survivor of mao, stalin and the likes share. You just know to much about humanity and the other to ever trust them again.
motohagiography 3y ago
Specifically, from the U.S. Holocaust museum, https://encyclopedia.ushmm.org/content/en/article/jewish-councils-judenraete https://encyclopedia.ushmm.org/content/en/article/jewish-cou... . I recently read the Eichmann trial coverage by Arendt, and she goes into this horrible situation in some depth. Getting people to betray and persecute each other for your benefit is probably the most essential definition of evil we have.

quickthrower2 3y ago

Drug dealers working with police for a reduced sentence. Spys?

Gustomaximus 3y ago

Look for examples of the useful idiot. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Useful_idiot https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Useful_idiot

Cthulhu_ 3y ago

I'm thinking of union busting infiltrators that point out the organizers to management so they get fired.

867-5309 3y ago

attending a gathering because they said they had a chicken and being expected to interact

octokatt 3y ago

I swear start-ups try to hire for Judas Goats as often as possible, normalizing long hours and "giving your all".