8 ms·

My understanding is that they are only removing products that ONLY contain Phenylephrine, which means they will still sell it when it is part of multiple-ingred

My understanding is that they are only removing products that ONLY contain Phenylephrine, which means they will still sell it when it is part of multiple-ingredient formulations, which are in themselves kind of a scam. For example, many OTC "severe cold/flu" formulations contain: - Acetaminophen. Potentially helpful for the body aches that come with the flu, but a lot of the time when I'm sick, I don't exactly need or benefit from a pain reliever. If you have a fever it can reduce it, but for a minor fever I'm not sure that is necessary. - A cough suppressant (Dextromethorphan) and an expectorant (Guaifenesin). Most recommendations I've read advise taking one or the other depending on the type of the cough, but not both. For a productive cough, a cough suppressant can be counterproductive. - For PM formulations, an antihistamine as a sleep aid. - And of course Phenylephrine as a decongestant, which doesn't work. People feel sick and they go in and just say "I'll take whatever is strongest" and they get overcharged for these weird formulations that are sort of kitchen-sink type things. I guess they are mostly harmless but you wind of spending $20 for pennies worth of out-of-patent ingredients that might actually make you feel a bit worse. And yeah, if you are actually congested, go to the pharmacy counter and get Pseudoephedrine. It costs next to nothing and in my experience works.

cma 3y ago
Not harmless with Acetaminophen of they don't realize it and also take pills at the same time, pretty narrow range to liver damage.
- shanewilhelm 3y ago
  You might be thinking of aspirin, which is toxic at fairly low dosages. Acetaminophen (aka Tylenol) is much, much safer.
  - tcoff91 3y ago
    I'm pretty sure you have it backwards. Tylenol/Acetaminophen is quite hard on the liver. https://www.health.harvard.edu/press_releases/acetaminophen_overdose#:~:text=Each%20year%2C%20overdoses%20of%20acetaminophen,the%20Harvard%20Women's%20Health%20Watch https://www.health.harvard.edu/press_releases/acetaminophen_....
    - k0k0 3y ago
      This is misleading. Tylenol in therapeutic dosages does not seem to have much ill effect on the liver, it is not like alcohols or other direct liver toxins. Even people with advanced stage liver disease can receive acetaminophen. When it becomes toxic at supratherapeutic doses it is very toxic.
  - PumpkinSpice 3y ago
    Acetaminophen has a narrow therapeutic index and can cause severe and irreversible liver injury in doses around 10 g. A single tablet usually contains 500 mg, but because it's a component of so many other "combo" cold meds, including some syrups, it's easy for people to overdose while mixing OTC products to get over a flu. Aspirin has a lower standard dose (325 mg), higher LD50 (probably around 20-25 g), and is generally safer. It has fallen out of favor because it's known to cause an exceedingly rare but deadly syndrome in a tiny percentage of children, and because it can have gastroenterological side effects. Ibuprofen is probably the safest option? I'm sure it can be overdosed, but it almost never happens, whereas acetaminophen results in tons of hospitalizations every year.
    - pdonis 3y ago
      > Ibuprofen is probably the safest option? Ibuprofen can also be liver toxic, but I believe the LD50 is significantly higher than the other options. I have not been able to find an exact number online. As has been mentioned by others in this discussion, ibuprofen can also cause stomach upset (my wife has this problem, even when she takes it with food).
    - k0k0 3y ago
      > Ibuprofen is probably the safest option? Are you kidding? Ibuprofen like most NSAIDS is terrible on the GI tract and the kidneys. People with healthy kidneys are usually fine with short courses, but even people with relatively mild chronic kidney disease should avoid NSAIDs. People in their 20s that overuse NSAIDs end up needing kidney transplants. it's not that uncommon. The most common cause of peptic ulcer disease of this demographic (affluent westerners) after H pylori is NSAID use. > It has fallen out of favor because it's known to cause an exceedingly rare but deadly syndrome in a tiny percentage of children This has really nothing to do why aspirin has less common use among adults. Aspirin has poor analgesic effects relative to the doses and the risks of GI complications. > acetaminophen results in tons of hospitalizations every year. The impact of NSAID related complications is far greater in terms of kidney transplants and upper endoscopy interventions, and related ICU stays.
    - lmm 3y ago
      > Ibuprofen is probably the safest option? I've heard it can damage the stomach lining if taken at the wrong time relative to eating. But yeah probably still the least-bad first-resort painkiller.
  - bmurphy1976 3y ago
    Aspirin and Ibuprofen will tear up your stomach and intestinal linings. Think internal bleeding. Alas I had to push back an epidural I desperately needed for back pain a few years ago by a week or two because I was taking too much Ibuprofen. I had blood in my urine as a result.
- pyrophane 3y ago
  Ah, good point. People combine alcohol and other meds with that all the time, which can be not so harmless. We shouldn't be putting that in random meds for people who are stuffed up or have a cough.
xienze 3y ago
> People feel sick and they go in and just say "I'll take whatever is strongest" and they get overcharged for these weird formulations that are sort of kitchen-sink type things. Well, it doesn’t help that most states require you to go to the pharmacy counter for the stuff that actually works (pseudoephedrine), and in some states you actually need a prescription.
- pyrophane 3y ago
  It is true. It created an incentive for people to avoid putting pseudoephedrine in things because most people weren't going to buy a formulation that they had to go to the counter for.
bmurphy1976 3y ago
Acetaminophen can help you sleep as well. Less aching == more restful sleep which in my experience is the best cure for most minor illnesses.
pdonis 3y ago
> if you are actually congested, go to the pharmacy counter and get Pseudoephedrine Yes, that's what works for me. And of course it used to be available OTC until the government decided to control access to it because of fears of meth.
- azinman2 3y ago
  Not fears, but actual improper usage.
  - goodluckchuck 3y ago
    What does that even mean? If you try to keep milk cold by putting it in the oven, that’s improper usage. It won’t stay cold. If you’re saying people are trying to get high and are successful getting high, then it sounds like they’re accomplishing their goal and their usage of the product is proper for their intended use case. Edit: Oh, you’re saying you don’t like what others are doing, but aren’t actually willing to state the fact that its just like your opinion man.
  - pdonis 3y ago
    No, fears that leaving it available OTC would result in lots of people using it to make meth. Which, as far as I can tell, was a fantasy: yes, lots of people were using meth, but there was no real evidence that they were using OTC pseudoephedrine to do it. (And, as others have pointed out elsewhere in this discussion, there is no need to go through all the work of making it from pseudoephedrine when the Mexican drug cartels can provide it cheaper anyway.) Which makes the government's position rather like the old joke about the man who claimed to have invented anti-tiger dust: Look at this wonderful anti-tiger dust I've invented? But this is the USA, there are no wild tigers within thousands of miles of here. See how effective my dust is?
- CodeAndCuffs 3y ago
  I mean we can see a demonstrable and quantifiable MASSIVE decrease in meth usage and overdose circa 2005 when the Combat Methamphetamine Epidemic Act went into effect. Also, it's still available without a prescription, last I checked, it was just behind the counter/required an ID to track if you're grabbing a pack from every Walgreens in a 50 mile radius in a single night
strunz 3y ago
>If you have a fever it can reduce it, but for a minor fever I'm not sure that is necessary. I think it's generally good to have a mild fever since it's how your body makes itself inhospitable to viruses
- pyrophane 3y ago
  I've heard that but I don't know if it has been borne out in any studies, so I didn't mention it in my original post.
- The_Blade 3y ago
  correct. a fever is your body's self-cleaning oven
mindslight 3y ago
The market is essentially just one step beyond basic snake oil. Instead companies mix various "approved" ingredients to create some branded concoction that they hope will stick from psychosomatic effects. For example "Excedrin" is just aspirin+acetaminophen+caffeine yet so many people swear by it rather than popping the two simple pills and considering if they really need another cup of coffee. The worst is when brand names are abused with suffixes to mean wildly different drugs, as if affinity for a corporate brand should come before consideration of the active ingredients. Similar deceit happens with cleaning products, where "Clorox" spray or "Clorox" wipes aren't bleach at all. Rather the spray is just some mild acid (a poorer disinfectant), and the wipes are quat (aka "Lysol", makes your pets sick). This kind of thing should be patently illegal - any brand should be required to have consistent active ingredients. Of course this isn't even considering the criminalization of well-working pseudoephedrine due to the government's dark ages persecution of drug-users-plus-everyone-else.
evanjrowley 3y ago
I shall mourn the loss of Phenylephrine. It worked for me, but I only ever suffered mild congestion. Not allergy-level super congestion, which I won't contest that it was ineffective against. Where it really helped me was with my post-nasal drip.
Auracle 3y ago
For what it’s worth, Afrin and other similar nasal sprays are by far the best decongestant. The only issue is you can only take them for a few days straight, or you’ll have rebound congestion when you try to quit. There are oodles of stories online of people who didn’t heed that advice and upped their dosages again and again for months. Here’s the best method: Afrin (etc.) at night so you can sleep, and during the day if you have something particular important going on. The next day, after you wake do a sinus rinse with xylitol. This clears out the Afrin preventing dependence, but xylitol also keeps things somewhat suppressed. Continue until cold is done. Source: me, a person with a ridiculously bad immune system that has multiple colds a year that last 3 weeks with nearly full congestion. (Also, Adderall is great for colds)
- PcChip 3y ago
  Afrin is so incredibly addictive that I highly recommend never using it… use it once and you’ll be hooked for years, trust me!
  - doubleg72 3y ago
    Yeah stick with the safe stuff, Adderall
  - Auracle 3y ago
    I use it quite a few times a year (in bursts) and I'm not hooked. I gave instructions in my post as to how. Colds don't last as long for my wife so she just uses it for 2-3 days and then stops.
  - EVa5I7bHFq9mnYK 3y ago
    True. You get used to it after a few days and now can't sleep without it, in a never ending cycle. There are much better drugs now, for example fluticasone (Flonase, Avamys).
- Uehreka 3y ago
  > (Also, Adderall is great for colds) Do not go around saying this, even if it’s true. We’re experiencing a huge Adderall shortage, and the last thing we need is people who were on the fence deciding to get a Rx because it might help them with cold symptoms in the winter.
phpisthebest 3y ago
>>go to the pharmacy counter and get Pseudoephedrine Thanks DEA, you used to just be able to get that in Nyquil and all the others, but the DEA in their moronic idea that drug dealers are going and buying precursors from the local CVS (not stealing them in bulk) has to abuse millions of law abiding sick people forcing them to sign the "papers please" log book treating them like criminals for wanting to feel better.
- AmericanChopper 3y ago
  There’s some places where you can’t get it at all without a prescription.
- goodluckchuck 3y ago
  Obviously retail pseudoephedrine was never a substantial contributor to methamphetamine production (tell me again why that’s illegal?). Which raises the question, what what the real goal in preventing people from buying functional medicines? Frankly I think the specific intent was exactly this. The main effect was to cause human suffering and Occams razor tells me the main effect was probably the intended effect.
  - qeternity 3y ago
    > Occams razor I think Hanlon's razor is more appropriate. Somewhere there was a team of people in the government who worked untold hours studying this, proposing solutions and ultimately having change enacted. This would have been good for career progression for all involved, not because it was actually good, but simply because they did something. And therein lies government.
    - paulmd 3y ago
      Hanlon’s razor is a thought-terminating cliche in most circumstances. Malice exists very frequently, as does profit-seeking or other motives that are indistinguishable from malice, and it's not at all the same thing as occam's "don't say god did it when there's a perfectly good mortal explanation" razor. It's essentially "memetic mimicry", where a second meme rides on the coattails of the first one, simply by obeying the overall form of the first meme so that its credibility "transfers over" to the second one. Like a common snake imitating a dangerous venomous one. In the DEAs case it was literally confirmed to be operating on malice since at least the Nixon and Reagan years, when it was overtly and publicly wielded as a weapon to disrupt hippies and black communities, specifically. There is absolutely no reason to assume good-faith when law enforcement is involved, and it is in fact a waste of the openness of your mind to do so. Go be open-minded about something else, literally anyone deserves that more than actual literal drug cops. > “You understand what I’m saying? We knew we couldn’t make it illegal to be either against the war or black, but by getting the public to associate the hippies with marijuana and blacks with heroin. And then criminalizing both heavily, we could disrupt those communities,” Ehrlichman said. “We could arrest their leaders. raid their homes, break up their meetings, and vilify them night after night on the evening news. Did we know we were lying about the drugs? Of course we did.” https://www.cnn.com/2016/03/23/politics/john-ehrlichman-richard-nixon-drug-war-blacks-hippie/index.html https://www.cnn.com/2016/03/23/politics/john-ehrlichman-rich...
suyula 3y ago
If the phenylephrine thing is true, that means I placebo'd my way through COVID in addition to every cold I've had in the past 15 or so years. Going from severely congested to not at all, every four hours, makes me think that it's got to be a "this only works in some people" drug.
- cmrdporcupine 3y ago
  Same. It has worked for me, and without the jitters and anxiety from pseudoephedrine (which is available OTC here in Canada still)
- Nursie 3y ago
  If it was a “works for some people” drug, you would expect to see a reproducible effect over and above placebo, but AFAICT that’s not the case with phenylephrine. Is there something else you’re doing or taking alongside that might explain it? If not … well, happy placebo-ing to you!
johnny99k 3y ago
I take severe cold/flu medicine with all of these ingredients. Without it, I can't sleep at night and It takes me much longer to recover. So to say it 'doesn't work' is nonsense.
deleted 3y ago
[deleted]

cma 3y ago

Not harmless with Acetaminophen of they don't realize it and also take pills at the same time, pretty narrow range to liver damage.

shanewilhelm 3y ago
You might be thinking of aspirin, which is toxic at fairly low dosages. Acetaminophen (aka Tylenol) is much, much safer.
- tcoff91 3y ago
  I'm pretty sure you have it backwards. Tylenol/Acetaminophen is quite hard on the liver. https://www.health.harvard.edu/press_releases/acetaminophen_overdose#:~:text=Each%20year%2C%20overdoses%20of%20acetaminophen,the%20Harvard%20Women's%20Health%20Watch https://www.health.harvard.edu/press_releases/acetaminophen_....
  - k0k0 3y ago
    This is misleading. Tylenol in therapeutic dosages does not seem to have much ill effect on the liver, it is not like alcohols or other direct liver toxins. Even people with advanced stage liver disease can receive acetaminophen. When it becomes toxic at supratherapeutic doses it is very toxic.
- PumpkinSpice 3y ago
  Acetaminophen has a narrow therapeutic index and can cause severe and irreversible liver injury in doses around 10 g. A single tablet usually contains 500 mg, but because it's a component of so many other "combo" cold meds, including some syrups, it's easy for people to overdose while mixing OTC products to get over a flu. Aspirin has a lower standard dose (325 mg), higher LD50 (probably around 20-25 g), and is generally safer. It has fallen out of favor because it's known to cause an exceedingly rare but deadly syndrome in a tiny percentage of children, and because it can have gastroenterological side effects. Ibuprofen is probably the safest option? I'm sure it can be overdosed, but it almost never happens, whereas acetaminophen results in tons of hospitalizations every year.
  - pdonis 3y ago
    > Ibuprofen is probably the safest option? Ibuprofen can also be liver toxic, but I believe the LD50 is significantly higher than the other options. I have not been able to find an exact number online. As has been mentioned by others in this discussion, ibuprofen can also cause stomach upset (my wife has this problem, even when she takes it with food).
  - k0k0 3y ago
    > Ibuprofen is probably the safest option? Are you kidding? Ibuprofen like most NSAIDS is terrible on the GI tract and the kidneys. People with healthy kidneys are usually fine with short courses, but even people with relatively mild chronic kidney disease should avoid NSAIDs. People in their 20s that overuse NSAIDs end up needing kidney transplants. it's not that uncommon. The most common cause of peptic ulcer disease of this demographic (affluent westerners) after H pylori is NSAID use. > It has fallen out of favor because it's known to cause an exceedingly rare but deadly syndrome in a tiny percentage of children This has really nothing to do why aspirin has less common use among adults. Aspirin has poor analgesic effects relative to the doses and the risks of GI complications. > acetaminophen results in tons of hospitalizations every year. The impact of NSAID related complications is far greater in terms of kidney transplants and upper endoscopy interventions, and related ICU stays.
  - lmm 3y ago
    > Ibuprofen is probably the safest option? I've heard it can damage the stomach lining if taken at the wrong time relative to eating. But yeah probably still the least-bad first-resort painkiller.
- bmurphy1976 3y ago
  Aspirin and Ibuprofen will tear up your stomach and intestinal linings. Think internal bleeding. Alas I had to push back an epidural I desperately needed for back pain a few years ago by a week or two because I was taking too much Ibuprofen. I had blood in my urine as a result.
pyrophane 3y ago
Ah, good point. People combine alcohol and other meds with that all the time, which can be not so harmless. We shouldn't be putting that in random meds for people who are stuffed up or have a cough.

xienze 3y ago

> People feel sick and they go in and just say "I'll take whatever is strongest" and they get overcharged for these weird formulations that are sort of kitchen-sink type things. Well, it doesn’t help that most states require you to go to the pharmacy counter for the stuff that actually works (pseudoephedrine), and in some states you actually need a prescription.

pyrophane 3y ago
It is true. It created an incentive for people to avoid putting pseudoephedrine in things because most people weren't going to buy a formulation that they had to go to the counter for.

bmurphy1976 3y ago

Acetaminophen can help you sleep as well. Less aching == more restful sleep which in my experience is the best cure for most minor illnesses.

pdonis 3y ago

> if you are actually congested, go to the pharmacy counter and get Pseudoephedrine Yes, that's what works for me. And of course it used to be available OTC until the government decided to control access to it because of fears of meth.

azinman2 3y ago
Not fears, but actual improper usage.
- goodluckchuck 3y ago
  What does that even mean? If you try to keep milk cold by putting it in the oven, that’s improper usage. It won’t stay cold. If you’re saying people are trying to get high and are successful getting high, then it sounds like they’re accomplishing their goal and their usage of the product is proper for their intended use case. Edit: Oh, you’re saying you don’t like what others are doing, but aren’t actually willing to state the fact that its just like your opinion man.
- pdonis 3y ago
  No, fears that leaving it available OTC would result in lots of people using it to make meth. Which, as far as I can tell, was a fantasy: yes, lots of people were using meth, but there was no real evidence that they were using OTC pseudoephedrine to do it. (And, as others have pointed out elsewhere in this discussion, there is no need to go through all the work of making it from pseudoephedrine when the Mexican drug cartels can provide it cheaper anyway.) Which makes the government's position rather like the old joke about the man who claimed to have invented anti-tiger dust: Look at this wonderful anti-tiger dust I've invented? But this is the USA, there are no wild tigers within thousands of miles of here. See how effective my dust is?
CodeAndCuffs 3y ago
I mean we can see a demonstrable and quantifiable MASSIVE decrease in meth usage and overdose circa 2005 when the Combat Methamphetamine Epidemic Act went into effect. Also, it's still available without a prescription, last I checked, it was just behind the counter/required an ID to track if you're grabbing a pack from every Walgreens in a 50 mile radius in a single night

strunz 3y ago

>If you have a fever it can reduce it, but for a minor fever I'm not sure that is necessary. I think it's generally good to have a mild fever since it's how your body makes itself inhospitable to viruses

pyrophane 3y ago
I've heard that but I don't know if it has been borne out in any studies, so I didn't mention it in my original post.
The_Blade 3y ago
correct. a fever is your body's self-cleaning oven

mindslight 3y ago

The market is essentially just one step beyond basic snake oil. Instead companies mix various "approved" ingredients to create some branded concoction that they hope will stick from psychosomatic effects. For example "Excedrin" is just aspirin+acetaminophen+caffeine yet so many people swear by it rather than popping the two simple pills and considering if they really need another cup of coffee. The worst is when brand names are abused with suffixes to mean wildly different drugs, as if affinity for a corporate brand should come before consideration of the active ingredients. Similar deceit happens with cleaning products, where "Clorox" spray or "Clorox" wipes aren't bleach at all. Rather the spray is just some mild acid (a poorer disinfectant), and the wipes are quat (aka "Lysol", makes your pets sick). This kind of thing should be patently illegal - any brand should be required to have consistent active ingredients. Of course this isn't even considering the criminalization of well-working pseudoephedrine due to the government's dark ages persecution of drug-users-plus-everyone-else.

evanjrowley 3y ago

I shall mourn the loss of Phenylephrine. It worked for me, but I only ever suffered mild congestion. Not allergy-level super congestion, which I won't contest that it was ineffective against. Where it really helped me was with my post-nasal drip.

Auracle 3y ago

For what it’s worth, Afrin and other similar nasal sprays are by far the best decongestant. The only issue is you can only take them for a few days straight, or you’ll have rebound congestion when you try to quit. There are oodles of stories online of people who didn’t heed that advice and upped their dosages again and again for months. Here’s the best method: Afrin (etc.) at night so you can sleep, and during the day if you have something particular important going on. The next day, after you wake do a sinus rinse with xylitol. This clears out the Afrin preventing dependence, but xylitol also keeps things somewhat suppressed. Continue until cold is done. Source: me, a person with a ridiculously bad immune system that has multiple colds a year that last 3 weeks with nearly full congestion. (Also, Adderall is great for colds)

PcChip 3y ago
Afrin is so incredibly addictive that I highly recommend never using it… use it once and you’ll be hooked for years, trust me!
- doubleg72 3y ago
  Yeah stick with the safe stuff, Adderall
- Auracle 3y ago
  I use it quite a few times a year (in bursts) and I'm not hooked. I gave instructions in my post as to how. Colds don't last as long for my wife so she just uses it for 2-3 days and then stops.
- EVa5I7bHFq9mnYK 3y ago
  True. You get used to it after a few days and now can't sleep without it, in a never ending cycle. There are much better drugs now, for example fluticasone (Flonase, Avamys).
Uehreka 3y ago
> (Also, Adderall is great for colds) Do not go around saying this, even if it’s true. We’re experiencing a huge Adderall shortage, and the last thing we need is people who were on the fence deciding to get a Rx because it might help them with cold symptoms in the winter.

phpisthebest 3y ago

>>go to the pharmacy counter and get Pseudoephedrine Thanks DEA, you used to just be able to get that in Nyquil and all the others, but the DEA in their moronic idea that drug dealers are going and buying precursors from the local CVS (not stealing them in bulk) has to abuse millions of law abiding sick people forcing them to sign the "papers please" log book treating them like criminals for wanting to feel better.

AmericanChopper 3y ago
There’s some places where you can’t get it at all without a prescription.
goodluckchuck 3y ago
Obviously retail pseudoephedrine was never a substantial contributor to methamphetamine production (tell me again why that’s illegal?). Which raises the question, what what the real goal in preventing people from buying functional medicines? Frankly I think the specific intent was exactly this. The main effect was to cause human suffering and Occams razor tells me the main effect was probably the intended effect.
- qeternity 3y ago
  > Occams razor I think Hanlon's razor is more appropriate. Somewhere there was a team of people in the government who worked untold hours studying this, proposing solutions and ultimately having change enacted. This would have been good for career progression for all involved, not because it was actually good, but simply because they did something. And therein lies government.
  - paulmd 3y ago
    Hanlon’s razor is a thought-terminating cliche in most circumstances. Malice exists very frequently, as does profit-seeking or other motives that are indistinguishable from malice, and it's not at all the same thing as occam's "don't say god did it when there's a perfectly good mortal explanation" razor. It's essentially "memetic mimicry", where a second meme rides on the coattails of the first one, simply by obeying the overall form of the first meme so that its credibility "transfers over" to the second one. Like a common snake imitating a dangerous venomous one. In the DEAs case it was literally confirmed to be operating on malice since at least the Nixon and Reagan years, when it was overtly and publicly wielded as a weapon to disrupt hippies and black communities, specifically. There is absolutely no reason to assume good-faith when law enforcement is involved, and it is in fact a waste of the openness of your mind to do so. Go be open-minded about something else, literally anyone deserves that more than actual literal drug cops. > “You understand what I’m saying? We knew we couldn’t make it illegal to be either against the war or black, but by getting the public to associate the hippies with marijuana and blacks with heroin. And then criminalizing both heavily, we could disrupt those communities,” Ehrlichman said. “We could arrest their leaders. raid their homes, break up their meetings, and vilify them night after night on the evening news. Did we know we were lying about the drugs? Of course we did.” https://www.cnn.com/2016/03/23/politics/john-ehrlichman-richard-nixon-drug-war-blacks-hippie/index.html https://www.cnn.com/2016/03/23/politics/john-ehrlichman-rich...

suyula 3y ago

If the phenylephrine thing is true, that means I placebo'd my way through COVID in addition to every cold I've had in the past 15 or so years. Going from severely congested to not at all, every four hours, makes me think that it's got to be a "this only works in some people" drug.

cmrdporcupine 3y ago
Same. It has worked for me, and without the jitters and anxiety from pseudoephedrine (which is available OTC here in Canada still)
Nursie 3y ago
If it was a “works for some people” drug, you would expect to see a reproducible effect over and above placebo, but AFAICT that’s not the case with phenylephrine. Is there something else you’re doing or taking alongside that might explain it? If not … well, happy placebo-ing to you!

johnny99k 3y ago

I take severe cold/flu medicine with all of these ingredients. Without it, I can't sleep at night and It takes me much longer to recover. So to say it 'doesn't work' is nonsense.

deleted 3y ago

[deleted]